Transcript | US v Pfc. Manning, Pfc. Manning’s Witness Testimony, Article 13 hearing, 11/29/12 and 11/30/12

UPDATE POST COURT-MARTIAL

United States v. Pfc.Manning was conducted in de facto secrecy. The public was not granted contemporaneous access to court filings or rulings during her trial. In addition to reporting on her trial, I transcribed the proceedings, reconstructed the censored appellate list, and un-redacted any publicly available documentation, in order to foster public comprehension of her unprecedented trial.

As a result of a lawsuit against the military judge and the Military District of Washington brought by the Center for Constitutional Rights, as well as my own FOIA requests, the official court record for US v. Pfc. Manning was released seven months after her trial.

The official trial docket is published HERE and the entire collection of documents is text searchable at usvmanning.org.

*During the pretrial proceedings, court-martial and sentencing of Pfc. Manning, Chelsea requested to be identified as Bradley and addressed using the male pronoun. In a letter embargoed for August 22, 2013 Chelsea proclaimed that she is female and wished to be addressed from that moment forward as Chelsea E. Manning.

This transcript of Pfc. Manning's testimony at his Article 13 motion hearing was taken at Fort Meade, Maryland on November 29th and 30th, 2012.

See Transcript of US v Pfc. Manning, Article 39(a), 11/29/12

[Court is called to order and Pfc. Manning is called to the stand by defense, and sworn in by the prosecution.]

Defense (Coombs)

Pfc. Manning I know this is a little nerve racking. So what we are going to do, is we are going to ease into this, and just take a little bit of time.Okay?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, I want to first start off by asking some questions about when you were detained in Iraq. Okay?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, do you recall the date that you were initially detained by [Army] CID?

Pfc. Manning

It was May 27 of 2010.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how did CID first approach you?

Pfc. Manning

CID first came to-- well I was first in the Supply-- I was in the Supply office at the Brigade annex, which was a separate building from Brigade headquarters at FOB Hammer in Iraq, and I was-- and then, I was escorted by the Supply NCOIC [Non Commissioned Officer in Charge] to an interview room.It was a conference room that had been turned into an interview room.And, I knew that--

Defense (Coombs)

When you walked in, what did you see-- when you walked into that?

Pfc. Manning

There was a table and two CID agents and a civilian agent that was unidentified. I don't know what agency of anything.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what happened after you were brought into the room with CID?

Pfc. Manning

They gave me my rights waiver form, which I did not-- I did not waive my right to an attorney.They read through that and filled it out.

Defense (Coombs)

And, after electing not to waive your rights, then what happened?

Pfc. Manning

They left. So, I sat in there for about an hour and a half, and then they came into-- they returned with brown paper bags with all of my belongings from the CHU [Compartmentalized Housing Unit] that were electronic-- and they had that outside the interview room.So, the interview room [missed a few words].

Defense (Coombs)

When you say CHU that is your living quarters?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, the Compartmentalized Housing Unit at FOB Hammer.

Defense (Coombs)

And, after this time period, were you required to be escorted, where ever you went?

Pfc. Manning

I was required to be escorted everywhere I went except for in the shower at the-- whenever I went into the shower trailer.They had-- I wouldn't have somebody there at all times for that.So, I had some privacy.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. And, did you at that point realize you were in pretrial confinement?

Pfc. Manning

I did not sir, no.

Defense (Coombs)

When did you first realize that you were actually were in pretrial confinement?

Pfc. Manning

It was a few days later.I think it was two or three days later when I was transferred to-- we went to-- I was escorted, along with the prosecution to Camp Victory[BFIF?] in Iraq to I think it was Camp Liberty, where we had our pretrial confinement hearing.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Did you recall the date of your pretrial confinement hearing?

Pfc. Manning

I don't remember the exact date.I think it was the night of the 29th or the 30th of May 2010, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, where-- I guess-- what happened at this hearing once you had the pretrial confinement hearing?

Pfc. Manning

Well I was-- we argued our points but I was placed-- but, I continued to be placed by the magistrate into pretrial confinement, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, after the pretrial confinement hearing was completed, where were you taken?

Pfc. Manning

I was taken-- we-- we had two escorts from my unit.They were from my company.We transferred to Camp Arifjan overnight.So, it took about 24 hours in transit.It's the logistics of being downrange.It took a while to get there, but we finally-- I finally arrived at Camp Arifjan in Kuwait.

Defense (Coombs)

And where were you held when you first arrived at Camp Arifjan?

Pfc. Manning

After an initial intake at the trailer, I was brought to a tent building hybrid. And, inside of it, there were two cage like cells.And, there is where I was held for the first 72 hours, I believe, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, can you describe the area.So, it was a tent, and there were two cells inside of it?

Pfc. Manning

There were two cage like contraptions that-- they were about eight by eight by, maybe, another eight cubed.So, it is a cube, and there is a rack and a toilet in there.

Defense (Coombs)

When you say rack, a bed?

Pfc. Manning

Right. The Navy calls their beds racks. So, that was where I slept.

Defense (Coombs)

So, there were two of these in this tent.Was there anyone else held in the other cell?

Pfc. Manning

Nobody was in the other cell, cage. I don't know what to call it, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. And, during the time that you were there.You said that you were held there for about 72 hours?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. It was a-- their indoctrination period.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what were you doing, during those 72 hours?

Pfc. Manning

I had-- I had their 'Manual for Guidance of Inmates' which is just basically their booklet on all the rules and what is expected of me at the facility.

And, I read through that, and it was pretty much the only thing I really could do. I mean, I had sheet and a pillow, and some blankets, and some changes of uniform, and some toiletry items, but I just stayed in there, except for going to chow.

Defense (Coombs)

Where you allowed to speak to anyone when you were in the 72 hour hold?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir, I was not.

Defense (Coombs)

Where you allowed to make any phone calls?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir I was not.Well, I did interact briefly with the guards as they gave me meals.They brought the meals to my cell.

Defense (Coombs)

Where did you go to after this 72 hours?

Pfc. Manning

They brought me to-- it was a tent with the other pretrial detainees that were at Camp Arifjan, and that's were I stayed during the day time [missed a word], and I slept at night.

Defense (Coombs)

And, before you were transferred to this other tent, we will talk about your conditions there, do you recall collapsing in your cell in the-- during that 72 period?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I don't remember if it was the second day I was there or not, but—and, I don't recall who exactly was there, but the lights weren't on—and, the air conditioning system was not working inside the tent, so it was hot in there.

It was dark.They had a door.So, it was still a tent, but it had a physical door that was built into it—and, two figures came in.

They started talking to me.I could not really understand what they were saying, and then I just faded out, and the next thing I knew I had the Navy corpsmen, you know, 'Are you okay?' He was asking me if I was okay, and I said , 'Yes.' I think I was just dehydrated, cause, you know, it was hot in there.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. Now, when you got transferred to the general population tent.Can you describe that for Colonel Lind [the Judge]?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, it is a twenty-man tent.So, it is roughly the size of the-- maybe twice the size of the panel area [in the Courtroom].So, not horribly huge, but enough for twenty men-- for twenty soldiers to live in, you know.And they had bunks inside of there-- maybe eight bunks.So, they were standard barracks bunks, metal bunks, and that is what--

Defense (Coombs)

So, you weren't in a cell, you got put into the tent?

Pfc. Manning

Correct. It was an open bay area.It was still a tent, but like an open bay area.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you were transferred there, how many detainees where in that open bay tent?

Pfc. Manning

There were usually between three to six there, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what time would you start your day when you were in that open bay tent?

Pfc. Manning

We-- Reveille which they called--The wake up call was reveille-- They called 'reveille' at 22 hundred, so at the-- right after sunset we were woken up, and we were-- that is whenever our day started.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so if I am understanding correctly.You were not on a normal day/night schedule, you--

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Defense (Coombs)

--your day started at 22 hundred hours?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

When did your day end?

Pfc. Manning

Our day ended at, I believe, it was at 13 or 14 hundred the proceeding day.

Defense (Coombs)

And what would you do on a typical day?

Pfc. Manning

Normally, we would-- first have a brief recreation call, exercise call, which we could walk around outside.There was a track area that was around-- in between the double fences of the facility.

And, then we would go to chow. We had a be back to the giant facility tent.We would be escorted to the dining facility tent, and we would stay there.And, then we stayed in a recreation tent for other times-- other lengthy time periods.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you are-- when you are in the recreation tent what could you do?

Pfc. Manning

There was a TV set, an old CRT TV set.There was a VHS player, and some library books, and a lot of old VHS tapes.

Defense (Coombs)

How many hours out of the day would you be in the tent, excluding the hours that you were sleeping?

Pfc. Manning

Excluding the hours that I was sleeping, we would either spend between four and ten hours inside of that tent. Although other times we spent, where if we weren't in-- we spent time in there. The reason why there is quite a large discrepancy is because there's a-- rec [recreation] we would spend time in the recreation tent or with the TV.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. So, during this time, were you able to call anyone?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. We had limited phone privileges that were early in our day-- so early in-- in the middle of the night, so around afternoon stateside time.So, we could-- it worked for most people to be able to call their families and things.

Defense (Coombs)

And, were you able to call your family?

Pfc. Manning

I didn't have a lot of phone numbers, so.I had my aunt's phone number.That is one.I memorized that.So, I called.So, yes.I did call family, or, I called, in particular, my aunt.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how did it feel to be able to speak to a family member?

Pfc. Manning

It felt really good to finally reconnect with somebody.It had been nine days, I think, that I had no contact with family at that point.

And, it was good to know that I wasn't fully cut off from the world, for at least those ten to fifteen minutes that we were authorized for that phone call-- for those phone calls.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you also able to speak with legal counsel for this time?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. We had attorney phone calls that would be scheduled by our-- by the TDS [Trial Defense Service] counsel. And, those were every-- I mean, they had a special area for those phone-- for those phone calls, but the TDS counsel I had didn't really call a lot, at that time.

Defense (Coombs)

Did there come a time when you were removed from the open bay tent back to a segregated tent?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I remember-- I think about two weeks into-- maybe a little bit less-- might have been actually just one week of being there.

I was put back into, and I stayed in the segregated-- the tent-- the tent with the cages and cells where I [missed a few words] again.

Defense (Coombs)

So, that would be roughly around the middle of June you think?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. So I would guess between the 14 and 18 June, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, did they tell you why you were being removed to the administrative segregation tent?

Pfc. Manning

I don't-- I don't remember exactly what the reasons were, sir.I don't know, if you have anything to remind me.

Defense (Coombs)

No. I don't have any documentation of that.So, can you describe the cell that you were moved to?

Pfc. Manning

It was the same cell that I was in for the reception time period, except I was able-- So I had my sheets, blanket, and changes of clothes, hygiene items, et cetera.

So, this is the same unit, but I would go out as I was-- I was just separated from everybody else during the time period in which they were in the tents.So, I still went to the recreation tent. I still went to the dining facility tent, et cetera.

Defense (Coombs)

So, even though you were held in the 'admin seg' tent you still went to the dining facility with the other pretrial confinees?You still went to recreation with other pretrial confinees?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Was anyone else in the cell with you at this time?

Pfc. Manning

No. There was another cell adjacent to it.But, nobody was in it, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what were you allowed to have within your cell?

Pfc. Manning

Again, it was sheets, pillow, pillow case, my uniform, so a couple changes of clothes, some books that I checked out of the library, and, yeah, that was—So, most of the items that I was authorized to have I kept inside the cell.

Defense (Coombs)

Where was this cell-- this admin segregation tent cell in relation to the tent that you were held at, with the open bay?

Pfc. Manning

It was approximately, I would say, eight or ten meters away, with a partition fence.

Defense (Coombs)

So, within close proximity to where you were previously held?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, can you describe for Colonel Lind, your typical day, once you were in this admin seg tent?

Pfc. Manning

It was almost identical to the one before, except instead of spending time in the open bay tent with the bunks.I would spend that time in my segregations cell.

Defense (Coombs)

How many hours a day do you think you were held in your segregation cell by yourself?

Pfc. Manning

Again, for four to eight.So that same time period, where I was in the open bay tent, transferred over into being in that other tent.

Defense (Coombs)

How did being held separately from everyone else impact you?

Pfc. Manning

I didn't talk to people as much-- I mean it was only during the recreation calls and things.So, yeah—And, spending that time alone-- I mean, it was such a-- I didn't know what was going on and, you know, in terms of the case or anything like that.I didn't have, like, formal charges or anything.

Really didn't know what was going on, or anything like that.So, I was really limited in my interactions with anybody.So, it was a little draining.

It was actually very draining.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how were you-- were you sleeping much during this time period?

Pfc. Manning

No. It was-- my nights were my days, and my days were my nights, so it all blended together after a couple days.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, during the deployment you also worked on the night shift is that true?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I did sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you have problems sleeping during the deployment?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I did sir, and I brought that to the attention of the NCOIC [Non Commissioned Officer in Charge] quite often.

Defense (Coombs)

So, the combination of not really getting a lot of sleep, and then the stress of just being in the cell by yourself, can you tell Colonel Lind how that was impacting you?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean, I am generally a pretty social and extroverted person, but, you know, was sort of put in that role of just sort of being there for long periods of time by myself.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you still able to make phone calls when you were in the admin seg tent?

Pfc. Manning

No. A few-- I think, because I-- I made-- I made, I think, three phone calls successfully.

One was to my aunt, because that was the only phone number that I really had. And, I think I made two-- I think I made one successful phone call to the only other number that I knew-- was for my-- the person I was in a relationship with previously, Tyler Watkins.

I talked to him.But those phone privileges were removed shortly after my first three phone calls. So I lost that privilege, I don't know why.

It was never explained to me.But, I lost that privilege pretty quickly.

Defense (Coombs)

Without having the ability to call family or call somebody that you were dating at the time, how did that impact you?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I don't know if we were dating.I don't know what the status was at that time for the relationship.But, you know, I was in pretty stressful situation. Not really-- I had really no idea what was going on with anything.

And, you know, I was getting very little information from Captain Bouchard, the defense attorney that was assigned at the time, because, he did have a lot of information either.So-- And that became sort of my only conduit, the one person that I really got any information from.

Because, at Camp Arifjan, they don't allow like news or-- they don't have any TV. Like the TV was separate. They didn't allow radio.So, you didn't get any current events information.It was just a contained environment.

Defense (Coombs)

Did there come a time when you were no longer taken out of your cell for the rec hall [recreation hall] and to eat?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. There was.

Defense (Coombs)

And when was this?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall the dates.I started to really deteriorate in terms of my awareness of my surroundings and what was going on.I was more insular.More worried about--just being anxious all the time about not knowing anything, and being worried. You know-- days turned to nights. Nights turned-- I mean everything blended together, and, just sort of just became more insular, and, I just sort of lived inside my head.

Defense (Coombs)

Where were you receiving your chow at this point?

Pfc. Manning

It was given to me through-- I was staying inside the administrative cell.So, back in the cage, and then they would give it to me just as before, whenever I was in the reception cells.

Defense (Coombs)

Did anyone ever explain to you why you were no longer being taken out of your cell to be with the other detainees?

Pfc. Manning

I didn't have a full-- really good understanding of the reasons.I think if somebody had-- I think somebody tried to explain it to me, but again I was just a mess at that point.I was really starting to fall apart.

Defense (Coombs)

During this time did the guards start inspecting your cell?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. They-- They went through-- They called it a 'shakedown'.It was pretty-- It was-- I mean it got to the point where they almost did it two to three times a day, where they would go in.

They would take me out of the cell, and have me sit down facing away from the cell. And then, they would just tear apart the-- at all the limited stuff that I had in the cell.Just throwing it everywhere.I don't know if they were searching for anything or if they were looking for anything, but it would definitely look looked through.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. Now, on June 30th 2010, do you recall losing control of yourself on that day to the point that medical doctors, mental health professionals had to intervene?

Pfc. Manning

Very limited-- memory of that.Very vague.I just remember being told about that mostly.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall yelling uncontrollably, screaming, shaking, babbling, banging your head against your cell and mumbling?

Pfc. Manning

Those details, no.But, I knew that I had-- I had just fallen apart.I mean I-- everything is fogging and hazy from that time period.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall why that happened at all?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean-- I usually know what is going on.I usually have a pretty solid knowledge of what's going on and I can figure things out-- like in terms of, you know, my--like-- like my job, or, you know, my family.I usually-- current events that are going on.

I am usually grounded pretty firmly in, like how I connect to the rest of the world, in those things.

So, after having those cut off, I really started to just not really get anything. I just started living inside my-- the limited surroundings that I had.

My world just shrunk to just Camp Arifjan, and then to that cage.

Defense (Coombs)

And, did you see any documentation at that point to know that what you experienced apparently was a breakdown or an anxiety attack?

Pfc. Manning

What is that, sir?

Defense (Coombs)

Did anyone show you anything?Or, did anyone talk to you later-- a mental health professional-- to explain what you experienced there was a breakdown or an anxiety attack?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I talked very frequently with mental health professionals-- both at the Camp Arifjan Hospital.They didn't have a full time psychiatrist or psychologist at Camp Arifjan itself.They had a medical doctor, a flight surgeon I think, sir.

And-- but I spoke pretty frequently with them.It was Lt. Commander Weber and Captain Richardson at Camp Arifjan Hospital and Mental Clinic.So, they are [missed end of phrase].

Defense (Coombs)

And, do you recall during this time making a noose out of bed sheets?

Pfc. Manning

Vaguely. I mean I just-- I remember-- I mean I don't remember that particular-- I remember being taken out, and them finding that.

I just remember my stuff being all over the place.Because, after they started doing the 'shakedowns', I stopped-- I stopped making my bed and things, you know.

Because, it was getting-- they were just tearing up all my stuff up all the time anyway. So, I don't recall making it, but I remember thinking, you know, 'I am gonna die.I am stuck here in this cage, and I don't know what is going to happen.'

Like, I mean, I thought I was gonna die in that cage, and that is how I saw it. It's like an animal cage.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you, at that point, plan on doing anything, taking your own life?

Pfc. Manning

I certainly contemplated it.I didn't.I mean it was sort of futile at the same time.I felt at the time there was no means.Even if I made a noose-- I mean, there wasn't anything I could do with it.I mean, there wasn't anything to hang it on, like.So, it just felt pointless.

Defense (Coombs)

After 30 June and having the breakdown, and then finding this material in your cell what happened?

Pfc. Manning

They took me out of that cell, and they moved me to the cell next to it.

They removed some of my clothing, and then they gave me a smock.They took away my glasses and everything.So, I had-- So, they put me into the cell adjacent to, but, I was-- they placed me on suicide watch at that point.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how long were you held in this cell?

Pfc. Manning

I believe thirty days with I believe a brief break for maintenance thing.

I don't remember the timing of that.But, I spent the rest of the time at Camp Arifjan inside the cell.

Defense (Coombs)

So, up until they time that they took you to Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

During this time, did you ever recall every speaking with Dr. Richardson?

Pfc. Manning

Captain Richardson?

Defense (Coombs)

Yes.

Pfc. Manning

Yes. He was a psychiatrist.I spoke to him on occasion.I don't know how often.A lot of the early time frame of early July is a total blur.

Defense (Coombs)

And, why is that?

Pfc. Manning

I had pretty much just given up.I mean, I did not know what was going on.And, nobody was gonna tell me anything.

And, you know, I remember I had limited contact with Captain.

I still had attorney phone calls, but I had like three Navy personnel that would sit around me while I was making these phone calls.And, we did not feel comfortable talking to each other over the phone about anything to do with what little Captain--

Defense (Coombs)

Bouchard?

Pfc. Manning

--Captain Bouchard knew about the case, because he did not know a lot at that time.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall telling Captain Richardson that you were considering committing suicide?

Pfc. Manning

I don't know how I conveyed it to him, but I explained what I did-- something similar to what I had just explained before.That, you know, I had contemplated it, and, you know, it was-- but, it also seemed pointless at the same time.

I was uncertain.I didn't want to.I didn't-- I didn't want to die.I just wanted to get out of that cage.I just remember being trapped on that cage, like all the time.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall telling him, that if you believe that you could be successful--

Prosecution (Fein)

Objection, your Honor. Leading their witness, the accused.

Defense (Coombs)

If I could finish my question?

Judge Lind

I am going to allow it for now.Go ahead.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall telling Dr. Richardson, that if you could be successful in committing suicide, you would?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I don't know how-- I don't know how I conveyed that to him, but I did.

Defense (Coombs)

And, why were you feeling that way?

Pfc. Manning

It just felt.I just pretty much had given up on a lot of things.

I mean I just remember that my world had just shrunk.It had just shrunk to this-- to this eight by eight sort of metal cell, and I didn't know what time of day it was or anything else.

That was sort of what I was trapped in.

Defense (Coombs)

Did Dr. Richardson give you anything to help you with how you were feeling?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. He gave me some medication. I know it was.It was an SSRI [Selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor].

I don't remember if it was Celexa or Zoloft.And, then a 'benzo'.I don't recall exactly what it was-- whether it was clonazepam or something similar.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how were you--

Pfc. Manning

--or Ativan.

Defense (Coombs)

How did this medication impact you?

Pfc. Manning

Whenever I take SSRI's-- cause I have taken them before, I have side effects.

So, I have nose bleeds, nausea for the first couple days.So I remember that.

I remember being very-- I wasn't given the full dosage for Celexa immediately.I was given a half-- I was given a half dosage for the first week, just to sort of curb on those initial side effects, and a urinary issues.

Defense (Coombs)

Did the medication that you were receiving, the Celexa or the other medication--

Pfc. Manning

--It was an SSRI, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--did that help you?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I mean, I started to flatten out by about two weeks-- maybe two weeks.I don't remember the number of days.It all just came together.But, halfway through that time period.

Defense (Coombs)

And, you say flatten out?What do you mean by that?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I wasn't nearly as anxious.I was talking to the guards that were watching me, and just sort of-- I felt better at that point.

Defense (Coombs)

By, 29 July of 2010, the date that you were moved from Kuwait and arrived to Quantico, how were you feeling?

Pfc. Manning

By 29 July?

Defense (Coombs)

Yes.

Pfc. Manning

I was feeling better.I was, you know-- felt more stable in terms of-- I meanI know I am in-- I know I am stuck here, you know.I don't know what is going to happen or what is going to go on at this point, but, you know, I figured I would ride it out, whatever it is.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you know what happened-- actually, let's go to the date that you were removed from your cell in Kuwait.When they took you out of your cell, did you know where you were going?

Pfc. Manning

I had no idea where I was going.I knew that I was leaving the facility.

Defense (Coombs)

How did you know that?

Pfc. Manning

They had briefed me.And, when I say they, I mean the corrections staff.

I don't remember who it was.I think it might have been-- I think it might have been the-- it might have been the executive officer.

I think it was Lt. [Commander? Bar?]-- might have been, but I think it was also-- I think it was an enlisted-- a senior enlisted person, sir-- maybe Master Chief or the Chief at the time-- and, basically said-- said, 'You're being transferred to a different facility.We are not gonna,' you know, 'That is all the information we have.'

And, then I started gathering my things in the cell.Cause they kept all my belongings in the cell next to me, but I was authorized to have them.They started inventorying that.

Defense (Coombs)

Describe that day for Colonel Lind.Like what happened once they got done inventorying, and you were being escorted out?

Pfc. Manning

It was almost sundown.Cause I remember the door was open to the tent.And, they inventoried my belongings.And, I was there present.They gave me-- They took away the smock and they gave me clothing.

And, then they brought me to the front of the facility where they had transfer to the medical staff.

I had a full physical done, and I filled out some-- I filled out some paperwork for receiving my [blinds?].

And, by this time it was dark, so I left the-- so, I left the facility, and it was probably about zero one in the night.

Defense (Coombs)

And, where were you taken?

Pfc. Manning

I was taken to a convoy of vehicles to Kuwait City to the airport at Kuwait City.

Defense (Coombs)

And, at this point did you know where you were going to be going?

Pfc. Manning

I had no idea.I only speculated to where I was going.I mean, I didn't know if I was going-- I didn't think I was going anywhere CONUS [Continental United States].I thought I was going to another-- I was hoping Germany-- Mannheim, Germany was a possible option.

Defense (Coombs)

Why were you hoping that?

Pfc. Manning

Well, it is not the alternatives which I speculated on at that time-- which was like Guantanamo Bay, Cuba or Djibouti or some place, you know, outside of the United States.

Defense (Coombs)

Why were you thinking that you might be taken to some of those places?

Pfc. Manning

I don't know.It was just a-- there was this-- I had been conveyed some serious charges, but I didn't really have a lot of guidance legally with Captain Bouchard, because of the limitations of the telephonic-- and having the guards there listening in-- so I just speculated and guessed.

I mean, I have worked-- I don't know-- I did not know how the American detention worked for, you know, American confinees.I knew for other detainees, but not for me-- not like soldiers for court-martial.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you scared what might happen to you?

Pfc. Manning

Certainly. I was very scared, but again I had no idea.

Defense (Coombs)

So, when you arrive at Kuwait City, what happens then?

Pfc. Manning

They brought me to a holding area at the facility.They removed a TV physically from that holding area, and I sat there for about eight hours until we got on a charter plane to, I believe-- We got on the plane--

Defense (Coombs)

When you got on the plane did you know where you were going?

Pfc. Manning

I did not, sir.I still had no idea where I was going-- but I was slightly more-- I was suddenly comforted by the fact it was a charter plane.So, it was a commercial airliner that was-- there was military personnel being moved somewhere.

Defense (Coombs)

Did the captain of the plane make any comments?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. The captain went over-- That was how I knew where I was going.The captain went over the intercom and said, you know, 'Flight time is this. We will be arriving at Mannheim, Germany,' you know, 'in the next however many hours--flight,' you know, 'altitude.'So, that is how I managed to figure out where I was going, in terms of that stage of the transportation process.

Defense (Coombs)

And, once you arrived in Germany, what happened?

Pfc. Manning

Again, I was taken to another holding area.Again, I speculated where I was going, not knowing.They removed me completely from the plane. I was in full restraints.I was a detainee.Although, I was still in Army ACU's [Army Combat Uniform]. And, then I was held in one of the terminals in Mannheim, and I think it was at Mannheim.It was Germany.

And, then sat there for aboutan hour and a half, and then we got back onto the plane.It was the same plane we were on before, and the same seating area.

Defense (Coombs)

And, at this point, did you know where you were going?

Pfc. Manning

Again, I found out the same way.It was a different captain, but he said, you know "Flight time.We should be arriving at Baltimore Washington International Airport,' you know, so.I knew I was going CONUS at that point, which was-- at least I was hoping that we were just going to stay CONUS.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how were you feeling at that point when you knew that you were going to be going to the States?

Pfc. Manning

I felt a lot better.I mean, I didn't think I was going to set foot on American soil for a long time, so.I was elated.

As silly as it sounds, it felt a lot better, knowing that at least I am going to be-- And, you know, I know Baltimore Washington International Airport.

So we actually landed and went through customs just like-- obviously for the soldier portion-- for the charter area-- but, went through customs just filling out the same-- filled out the same paperwork, you know, transferred through.

So, it was great to be in familiar surroundings-- American soil-- BWI [Baltimore Washington International Airport].

Defense (Coombs)

And, where did you go once you got-- from BWI?

Pfc. Manning

They got a rental car.So, I was in a holding area.So, they transported me very quickly into the vehicle through the terminal, into the parking or into the bay area.

Just got into a Dodge Charger-- I think it was a Charger.

Defense (Coombs)

A van?

Pfc. Manning

No, it was a Charger.

Defense (Coombs)

Oh, and actual car?

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. And then, where were you taken?

Pfc. Manning

We drove South.And, I eventually figured out from the-- they had Google Maps-- a print out of the directions to Quantico. So, I knew then that was the destination.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so we're now going to talk about your arrival at Quantico.Before I go in there, do you need a break or are you okay?

Pfc. Manning

I am good, Sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. What time did you get to Quantico.

Pfc. Manning

I don't know the exact time.It was early evening.So, maybe about 6 p.m.

Defense (Coombs)

And, at this point how long had you been awake?

Pfc. Manning

Over 24 hours with-- I slept for maybe 90 minutes on the plane from Germany to BWI.

Defense (Coombs)

And, why did you sleep so little on the plane?

Pfc. Manning

It was difficult.There were restraints and I was-- I was being-- it wasn't comfortable positions. It was a coach type seat with full restraints-- so, a body cuff.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So, when you got to Quantico, can you tell Colonel Lind what happens?

Pfc. Manning

Taken to their in processing area-- so through the side of the facility they have an in processing area for detainees.I was transferred administratively, in terms of paperwork.

Taken to the changing area, where I was strip searched-- scars, marks, tattoos is what they normally do.They take notations of that.

They had signs with Marine Corps rank.And, I was--I had Marine Corps correctional specialists working. They were doing the strip search and everything-- explaining to me-- well not really explaining-- but telling me what to do at that point.

Defense (Coombs)

So, after you got through this, what did the guards say to you?

Pfc. Manning

What did they say to me?I mean-- I mean it's-- it's-- they are ordering me to do things.So, I fill out paperwork mostly.

I was taken to a dark area-- or a dark room next door, and then I have then Corporal Hanks, you know, ask me a bunch of question-- like administrative information, suicide risk questions, et cetera, and filled out paperwork.

And, I spent several hours filling out paperwork.

Defense (Coombs)

At that point, did you-- once you were filling out paperwork-- did you respond to any questions from the actual guards?

Pfc. Manning

Well, yes. That is what they were doing. They-- I was-- They would ask me questions, like, 'Do you have any psychological disorders?' or 'What's your address?' 'What is your name?' Things like that, so.

Defense (Coombs)

And, were they telling you whether or not you were getting any of these answers wrong or right?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I mean, because it's a-- whenever you-- in processing into the Marines Corps facility.And, I assume that every correctional facility I have been to, it is a sort of a 'shark attack' basic training-- called a 'shark attack' environment where you're-- everything you do is wrong.They are trying to build you up from, you know, they try to show you who, you know-- that they are the ones that are in charge.So they-- you know, they tell you what to do.

I mean, I don't know what a bulk-- I didn't know what a bulkhead was, and they told me to face the bulkhead, 'Okay,'I felt,'I don't know what a bulkhead is.'

'Face the bulkhead!' and I learned like Navy terms as well, and Marine Corps rank and things like that.And everything I did was wrong at that point, you know, in terms of-- I got rank wrong, and I got all kinds of things wrong,because I didn't know, so--

Defense (Coombs)

Alright--

Pfc. Manning

--I was learning.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall ever writing down, 'Always planning, but never acting' on your intake questionnaire with regards to a question of suicide?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. They-- There was a lot of questions that-- I was swarmed with all the paperwork, and they were-- most of it was verbal.

So, I said to the suicide questions both times I said, 'No. Not suicidal.'You know, but they would ask me questions like, 'Well why were you on suicide-- Why were you on Suicide Watch then?'

It was, you know-- It was-- They would ask a question and then would sometimes say I was wrong, you know, in terms of like my address, and not giving them the Zip Code, 'Are you going to give us the Zip Code?'

I mean, and that was sort of the vibe that I got through that, and asking questions.

And, it was the same with paperwork.I filled out the paperwork, and it was a page at a time.

So, I would fill out one page, and then they would-- and then I would have-- I think it was-- it was then Corporal Hanks, later Sergeant Hanks that filled out or that examined the paperwork, and so I would have to cross things out, because it was wrong, or, you know, or not what they were expecting in terms of the dates, you know, they have their dates different.

And, when I came to that question, they said that, you know, because I was on suicide watch, I had to put something down on that.So, I did.

I wasn't thinking to much about what I was putting down, but, you know, I put it down, and I regret it.

But, it was sort of sarcastic, because I had spent so much time on suicide watch in Kuwait.I didn't really-- and I had been told by Master Sergeant Papakie, who briefed me, for a brief period of time that I was going to be on suicide watch, whenever I was finished, so.

So, that is what I filled out-- the paperwork.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Now, were you eventually moved to a cell?

Pfc. Manning

Later, but I-- I went and talked to Captain Hocter first.That was the first time that I had met Captain Hocter.

They took me to an office, one of the medical offices, and I spoke with him for about an hour and a half.

And, then I returned to filling out paperwork, but then they moved me to the cell.

It was already past lights out, or 'taps' as they call it at the Brig.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what time would that normally be?

Pfc. Manning

It was 22 hundred, sir.So, it was past 22 hundred, but I was still filling out paperwork, and again it was very similar.

I would have one sheet of paper examined by the guard, and looked over for any mistakes or anything.

I just wanted-- at that point I just wanted-- I think they offered a shower, but I just wanted to go to sleep, because I hadn't slept in so many hours.

I had been in transit for the last almost two days-- it felt like, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so overall, even though being tired, how did you feel about being at Quantico, and being in the United States?

Pfc. Manning

Oh, it was great, because-- I mean-- I mean I know it is not the ideal environment, but it is a-- it is a brick and mortar building.

It's got air conditioning.It's got solid floors, hot and cold running water.

I mean a lot of amenities that I wasn't use to for that period of time-- for quite a lengthy period of time.So I felt--And, it was great to be on continental United States soil.

It was-- that felt like reassurance, especially being in the DC/Baltimore, Northern Virginia area.I live in Maryland, and so I knew the area as well, and I knew that family could visit, and I had been told that my family could visit.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you get a visit from your company commander at this point?

Pfc. Manning

That was the following morning.

Defense (Coombs)

And, who was this?

Pfc. Manning

Captain Casamatta.This was my company commander at the time, and I had-- I didn't know that they had actually PCS [Permanent Change of Station ] move me to the Military District of Washington.

So, then I was introduced to my new company commander, First Sergeant--Captain Casamatta, and First Sergeant Williams.

They came to me the next day.It was great to talk to them, because I got a run down of a lot of things I didn't know in terms of PCS move and, you know, where my belongings were, and what chain of command I fall under and everything else.

So, I got a lot explained to me in that time period.I felt reassured that I had such an awesome, you know, company commander-- was a very reassuring feeling, you now, from being in a-- and I know it sounds silly, you know, but, even though it was Quantico Base Brig-- it's a prison, but, you know, but it was just a permanent structure, at that time.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, and I imagine once you are at Quantico, where you able to see family member?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I mean there was an indoctrination period.

So, I was given a booklet on what rules and regulations I was-- even though I was-- I was on suicide risk status at that time, but they allowed an exception.

They allowed my aunt to come and visit me.That was the first time I had seen family members.

Defense (Coombs)

Where you able to meet with defense counsel?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I had been assigned at that time, Major Hurley as temporary defense counsel.

Just for the transition period, so I spoke to him a few days after-- if not the immediately following my command visit.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what sort of status were you on at this point?

Pfc. Manning

I was placed on-- and I was told when I arrived there, that I was going to be on the same status as I was in Kuwait, suicide risk status, and that I would be evaluated, and then I would have, you know, a classification set in a few days.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you told what custody status? Maximum?Medium?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean, if you are on--if you are on POI [Prevention of Injury] or MAX-- I was on MAX.If you are on suicide risk status, you are automatically placed on MAX status, so.I was automatic, so.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. And, let's talk about some of the-- for a moment-- what it meant to be on maximum custody status for you? Okay? How often, where you required to be physically checked?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I had line of sight.So, there was a guard-- this is just a--

Defense (Coombs)

Just for MAX.We will talk about the suicide [risk] in a moment?

Pfc. Manning

Oh. For MAX status, the facility-- the Quantico Base Brig MAX status, I believe was, I believe either ten minutes or five minutes for MAX status.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how were you checked when you were on MAX status?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I was checked more frequently, because my statuses were-- because I had an additional status added on to-- a part from the classification with it.

I guess if you calculated, I think they only do ten minutes checks for MAX status.

But, I don't know, because I was never-- I never had anything less than five minutes.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how would they check you for those five minutes?

Pfc. Manning

I mean they would physically-- I mean and when I say physically I mean they would open-- cause they were in an observation booth.

They would open the door, and ask, you know--They would verbally ask me if I was okay.

Sometimes they poked their head out the door, and have line of sight and then ask me.

And, I would always have to respond as a courtesy to the-- usually they assigned a Lance Corporal for that role, but sometimes it was a Corporal, and that was how they-- that was how they checked on me during the daytime.

Defense (Coombs)

The SECNAV instructions indicates that if you are on MAX you are not assigned outside work details.Were you assigned any outside work details?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you even express any interest in being assigned work details?

Pfc. Manning

It had been conveyed to me by Gunnery Sergeant Blenis, when he was asking-- whenever he was interviewing me for the first time, that the jobs were available for, you know, if my status or custody level had changed.

So, I said I am more of a clerical guy or good with paper and stuff, and he was like-- cause I did not know what was available, so.

I am not really very good with physical stuff.So, he told me that the only thing like that was the library, so I expressed interest in that.

I said that I could probably implement some kind of system to organize everything, if that wasn't already in place.

Defense (Coombs)

And, were you ever assigned duties in the library?

Pfc. Manning

I was not, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Where were you assigned with regards to a cell?

Pfc. Manning

They kept me-- there were four cells that were directly in front of an observation booth with a two-- I mean it's a window, but-- I mean you can only see-- it's tinted-- it's heavily tinted on one side.

So, you can only see your reflection on the well lit side.So-- I forget what it is called-- it's a one-way mirror or one-way glass or one way window-- but I was held in one of the three.I think it was-- I stayed-- They moved me around once or twice, but I stayed in three cells-- one of three cells.

So, two on one side, and one on the other side of that other observation booth.

Defense (Coombs)

And, those that you stayed in, were always within sight of the observation booth?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. I want you to describe your cell, but in order to do that, I want to go ahead and make use of what we have here in the Courtroom, okay? 



[Coombs is referring to an at scale representation of Pfc. Manning's cell at Quantico made with white paper tape on the floor of the Courtroom.]

A9CamYrCQAAFUXA Image source: Clark Stoeckley

Pfc. Manning

Absolutely, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, if you would go head and please step out of the witness booth-- a the witness chair. 



[Pfc. Manning stands up and walk near Mr. David Coombs.]



Alright. First of all what I want to do is--

Judge Lind

Mr. Coombs, remember I have the big screen here.So, it is difficult.I can't see it right now with that.

Defense (Coombs)

Ma'am, do you want to reposition or anything?

Judge Lind

That's fine.That's fine.

Defense (Coombs)

We are going to be walking through here though, a lot, so of the Court wishes--

Judge Lind

Well, I'll stay.I'll move if I have to.Go ahead.

Defense (Coombs)

[to Pfc. Manning]

So, actually come up around this side for a me.That's okay.Now, looking at this, this cell.Do you know the dimensions of the cell that you were in?

Pfc. Manning

It was roughly six foot by eight foot to [missed word].

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so what I am going to do.I am just going to ask you to read how wide this is right now.

[Mr. Coombs pulls out a metal tape measure.]

Pfc. Manning

That is about five eleven, six feet.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. And, so six feet.

Pfc. Manning

I don't know how many centimeters.

Defense (Coombs)

Well, we will just go ahead and go-- so how far is this?

Pfc. Manning

So, that is 95 inches, eight feet--

Defense (Coombs)

Eight feet, okay.

Pfc. Manning

--96 inches.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so your cell, if I am correct, was six feet wide?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, it was eight feet long?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so this map area represents your living space that you were in at Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

Very [missed word].Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so now what I would you do is-- is lets go ahead and come into the cell--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--and tell me what are some of the things that we have here.

Can you identify?



[Defense has also used white paper tape on the floor to outline items within the cell.]

Pfc. Manning

I had a rack that was on a large metal things, so-- it would be a rack right here, which I slept on.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay, and if you would, put 'rack' down onto where the rack would be.



Pfc. Manning

Right, here Sir.

[Pfc. Manning takes a paper card with the word, 'rack' written on it and places it in the middle of the white paper tape outline of the rack within the white paper tape representation of his Quantico cell on the Courtroom floor.]

Judge Lind

Can you identify for the record how high the--

Defense (Coombs)

Yes, Ma'am.How high off the ground was the rack?

Pfc. Manning

About two feet, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. And the witness displayed that by using a hand gesture two feet off the ground.Can you tell me what this area is?

Pfc. Manning

I had a toilet and sink in this area, sir.So, there would be a sink right here at about, like, waist high, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

How high-- how high would you say that is?

Pfc. Manning

Maybe, three and a half, four feet, sir.No, it is a little less.

Defense (Coombs)

If you can put the sign of sink down, where the sink was?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir.

[Pfc. Manning places a sign with the word 'sink' written on it down in the sink outline made with white paper tape inside the white paper tape representation of his former Quantico cell.]

Defense (Coombs)

And, then you said that this other area was the toilet?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

It's a-- it comes-- the bowl physically comes out of the sink.

The metal bowl-- stainless steel bowl-- it's a-- at a lower level.So, it's about a foot and a half to the actual seating area of the bowl.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, and if you put the sign where the toilet is?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

[Pfc. Manning places a sign with the word 'Toilet' written on it down in the toilet outline made with white paper tape inside the white paper tape representation of his former Quantico cell.]

Defense (Coombs)

Now, did the toilet have anything blocking it in order to obstruct the view from the observation room to the toilet?

Pfc. Manning

The observation room was right here with the door-- right where Specialist Vincent is.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so when you say right here towards the middle the diagram of the cell?

Pfc. Manning

The door to the cell?

Defense (Coombs)

Yes.

Pfc. Manning

--was right here.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Let's go through.When you say right here, I have capture this for the record.So--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--so, for the door that-- let's talk about the observation room.Where was the observation room in relation to your cell?

Pfc. Manning

It was right across from my cell.And, this is assuming it's 191.Then, if it is cell 191, then it was slightly offset.

So, right across but slightly offset.So, maybe two thirds of it was actually in front of the cell.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so from the observation room in front of your cell.They could see clearly your entire-- your cell, correct?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. What I would like you to do now. We have got some items here. If you would go ahead and pick up. Hold on the blanket that was provided.This-- You are holding up what has been marked appellate exhibit 411.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--an actual photograph of that.And is this the same type of suicide blanket that you were provided?

Pfc. Manning

Mine was slightly thicker, and made out of a slightly coarser fabric.This is a little bit more used.This is more-- the ones that I was provided were straight out of the box.

Defense (Coombs)

And so, how did this blanket differ than the one that you were given?

Pfc. Manning

Slightly-- Slightly heavier, and a lot less flexible.It was the same color though.

Defense (Coombs)

So, the one that was slightly heavier and less flexible is the blanket that you were given?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. It was maybe a slightly lighter shade [missed word].

Defense (Coombs)

And when you used that blanket did that blanket impact you in anyway?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I mean even this one isn't very comfortable, but I mean the smock is actually made out of the exact same fabric that I had for the blanket I was given.This is--

Defense (Coombs)

How, if at all would that blanket affect your skin?

Pfc. Manning

It was a coarse fabric.So, it is not very comfortable.It is abrasive on skin at least.I mean I got-- I had at that point in time, pretty sensitive skin [missed a few words].

Defense (Coombs)

So, that would that be like a carpet burn?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. More like a rash.Slight burn, yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you ever complain about that to any of the medical?

Pfc. Manning

They-- I don't remember who the original corpsmen was.I think it was an E5.So, he was a-- he was a petty officer second class.I don't remember his name-- but, to that corpsmen and to the later added corpsmen for the OCS [Officer Candidate School], which was across the street from the Brig-- special-- not special-- E4, but petty officer, so HM3[Hospital Corpsman Third Class] Dodsin [sp.] was the corpsmen, and I would mention it.

But you know-- I mean it became sort of routine thing that I was-- that I got-- I got a bit of a rash.But, there nothing that he could really do for it.

Defense (Coombs)

If you would put down-- appellate exhibit 411 back.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Place it here?

Defense (Coombs)

Yes, please.Taking now a look at appellate exhibit 415, which is the suicide smock.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Is that the same suicide smock or similar to what you were given?

Pfc. Manning

This is exactly the same, except mine was brand new.So, this one is a little bit, slightly more used, but not by much.

Defense (Coombs)

And, so the feel of the material is the same?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. The same material.Same weight.Same color.Same fabric.

Defense (Coombs)

What about--

Pfc. Manning

--same manufacturer.

Defense (Coombs)

--what about the size of this smock?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. It is the same size-- made out of the same [missed two words].

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. If you would please put the suicide smock on justto see the size.

Pfc. Manning

[to Coombs] Do you want me to remove the jacket?

Defense (Coombs)

That is fine.

Pfc. Manning

[Pfc. Manning removes his uniform jacket and tears open the industrial Velcro straps of the suicide smock.He dawns the suicide smock which is enormous on his small frame.]

Pretty strong [missed a few words. The Velcro strips make a loud noise when ripped open.]

Defense (Coombs)

From your memory, is that how the suicide smock fit you?

Pfc. Manning

This is a little bit more used, so it is a lot more flexible.It was a little but more rigid-- the one that I had, because it was brand new, so.

Defense (Coombs)

And, based upon this suicide smock, did you ever have an experience where it caused you any problems?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I was laying down on the rack trying to sleep and I remember my arms went into it, and I don't want to do that right now, but my arms got into it and I got stuck.

Defense (Coombs)

And, did you need any assistance getting out of the suicide smock?

Pfc. Manning

I did. I was still taking some sleep medication at the time, and I had I remember Corporal Sanders was the guard who actually came to the-- he opened the cell door and assisted me out of it-- released the [missed word].

It strong, [missed a few words] so I couldn't get out of it-- [missed word].

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. If you would, go ahead and take the suicide smock off.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir.

Defense (Coombs)

If you would, go ahead and place that back down [missed word].

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Now I would look at appellate exhibit 414.It is identified as the suicide mattress.Is this the mattress that you were provided?

Pfc. Manning

The mattress is-- this was very similar to the mattress I was first mattress I was given, before given the specific suicide mattress.

This is the same mattress that all cells in special quarters one had.

Defense (Coombs)

So, this was the mattress that you were given initially?

Pfc. Manning

It is the same type of mattress.The one that I had was slightly newer.And, so it was-- it was not as bendy or flexy--

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, and--

Pfc. Manning

--if that is possible, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

I apologize.That could be appellate exhibit 413, the standard confinement mattress that you just described.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Let's go ahead and take a look at appellate exhibit 414.If you would, Pfc. Manning, just come approach appellate exhibit 414.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Can you-- do you recognize this?

Pfc. Manning

No, I do not sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Have you ever seen anything like this?

Pfc. Manning

I have seen-- I mean it's got a pillow, so it is like a-- like a suicide mattress that I was given.

But, the one I had is a lot-- is a lot more similar to the green one on there.

This one is a lot-- its made out of-- its a lot more-- it's a lot thicker.Looks more like an air mattress to me, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, how was your mattress-- the suicide mattress that you were provided for the majority of your time there-- how was that different than this one?

Pfc. Manning

It was more like this green one except brand new-- like right out-- like had never been ever used before, and-- and it had a built in pillow just like that.

It wouldn't-- it wouldn't have-- it would have been a lot harder to bend like this-- like this is very flexible.It was a lot harder to bend.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. And, if we take a look now--

Pfc. Manning

Sir?

Defense (Coombs)

--the pillow, which is appellate exhibit 412.Have you ever seen anything like this before?

Pfc. Manning

I have seen a pillow like this in Kuwait-- at Camp Arifjan.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you ever given anything like that at Quantico Brig?

Pfc. Manning

I was not, sir.I was never issued a pillow at Quantico Base, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Retrieving the exhibit from the witness.Pfc. Manning go head and resume your position in the stand.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

[Pfc. Manning sits back in the witness stand.]

Defense (Coombs)

So, this cell that we see on the courtroom floor, how many hours out of the day would you be in this cell?

Pfc. Manning

Depending on what the schedule of calls was for that day, and visitation to other areas, whether it was a legal visit or a counselor visit outside of my cell.

It was between 21 and 23 hours-- sometime even over 23-- as much as 23 and a half hours [missed word].

Defense (Coombs)

So, what would you do inside of this six by eight foot cell for 23 hours a day?

Pfc. Manning

I would normally sit or just do something.

I mean, just try to keep myself occupied.So, I would try to think of something to do.I would usually sit on the rack, sir.

Sometimes they would allow me to have my legs up on the rack, in sortof an Indian style position, but sometimes that was not authorized.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you have any natural lighting that was coming into your cell?

Pfc. Manning

In 191 or 192? No, sir.

Those two cells-- I don't know about the other cell, because I was only in there for-- the one across from-- I don't know how long I was there for-- maybe just two days before-- just maintenance or something like that, so.

But, there was no reasonable way of accessing natural or indirectly seeing natural light.

You could see the window down the hall, from the cell-- but if you took your head and put it on the cell door, and looked through the crack between the cell door and the rest of the grating for the cell-- you could see down the hall-- you could see the reflection of the window-- but you couldn't see the actual window.

But, none of that natural light would actually come in from that window.

Defense (Coombs)

Was there any skylight in the facility?

Pfc. Manning

In the housing unit between-- about half way between-- So my-- I would draw it-- I will just try and use my hands.But--

Defense (Coombs)

Essentially-- just try to describe it, because I am gonna have to describe what you do when you when you use your hands.

Pfc. Manning

It was half way in between the-- in between the hall, the row, as they called it-- in special quarters.

It faced outwards towards the exit.So, it is halfway in between, and there is like a low ceiling over the first third of special quarters.

Then the ceiling goes up maybe twenty feet.There is a skylight that is facing the opposite-- pointing actually outside, then it goes down, and it goes down at an angle towards the fire exit and window.

Defense (Coombs)

Did any of the natural light from that skylight, make it to your cell?

Pfc. Manning

Not inside the cell.Again, you could see the reflection of the reflection of that light on the floor-- on the reflection of the floor from-- if you angled your face-- again, upon the door of the cell, which I wasn't allowed to do, but-- normally, at least.

Defense (Coombs)

How was your cell light during the day?

Pfc. Manning

There was a fluorescent light over the rack.

Defense (Coombs)

And, were these lights turned off at night?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. There were turned off at night. Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Was there any other lighting coming into your cell at night?

Pfc. Manning

Outside the cell, particularly two cells that I was held in the most: 191 and 192.

There is a fluorescent light directly outside, I believe, 191 in particular that just blasts, full fluorescent light into the cell.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how did that light effect you if at all?

Pfc. Manning

Well, your-- my head, when you are sleeping, you are gonna have your feet towards the-- towards the observation area, with the head towards the wall at the back of the cell.

You couldn't turn any other way.So that they can see your face.So, right directly in front of you, if you did not have anything obstructing your path was the fluorescent light.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So, when we look at the diagram of the cell, again, then your head would be roughly at the same level of the toilet?

Pfc. Manning

Roughly. Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And then your feet...?

Pfc. Manning

I-- I could see-- first thing in the morning I could see the toilet.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, also under the SECNAV, it requires MAX prisoners to wear restraints when they are outside of their cell?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

What restraints were you required to wear?

Pfc. Manning

I was required to wear, what they considered full restraint.So, I wore hand irons. Just, regular handcuffs with a metal loop, and a belt-- leather belt was attached to that loop.

And, then I was given leg irons for both-- on both my feet with a 20, maybe 18 inch chain between-- I am guessing at the length [missed a few words]...

Defense (Coombs)

How-- how--

Pfc. Manning

--without a measure.

Defense (Coombs)

How difficulty was it for you to walk in your full restraints?

Pfc. Manning

You cannot walk in full restraints without a guard holding you as a safety precaution.

Defense (Coombs)

And, why is that?

Pfc. Manning

Cause, you can easily just fall, straight on your face, because-- with the belt, with the hand iron, with the hand iron, they are towards your belly button. So, your hands are near your belly button, so you can't stop your self from failing, or anything like that, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Were these restraints taken off of you, when you went to the visitation room?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. I might have, on occasion, had one hand released, but it would still-- but my other hand would still be locked in to the belt for-- for writing.

Defense (Coombs)

Was this also true when you were visiting with your attorney?

Pfc. Manning

That was only for attorney visits, and whenever I was signing paperwork with my command, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

When you were removed from your cell, how were you escorted?

Pfc. Manning

I was escorted with usually at least two guards and an NCO [Non Commissioned Officer], but it was-- it often went up to three guards and an NCO, and sometimes four guards and an NCO were transporting where I needed to go, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And how was the facility when you were moved?What did they do to the facility?

Pfc. Manning

They would place the entire facility on lockdown.So, no inmates would be moving, throughout the facility.No other detainees or prisoners or whatever status they were in: post trial, pretrial-- it would all be-- they were put in their cells, or where ever they were, and locked down.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how do you know that?

Pfc. Manning

They would announce over the intercom system.They would announce, 'Lockdown. Lockdown. Lockdown.' Three times, or 'Lockdown' three times, and then-- and then-- well, standby for 'Lockdown' lets you know that it was going to occur and they would announce the lockdown, and then-- and then movement was authorized for-- or they could start moving me at that point, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how were you moved from your cell at that point.Can you just describe that for Colonel Lind?

Pfc. Manning

Well, after-- I mean-- after I am placed in restraints, sir?

Defense (Coombs)

No. The process of you are in your cell and they are gonna move you, what do they do?They haven't put any restraints on you yet.

Pfc. Manning

Okay. I approach the cell door, near the feed tray, which is in front of me.I stand at parade rest at first.Then they-- the guard, usually a lance corporal, or sometimes a corporal, would instruct me to put both hands or one hand out through the feed tray, and then would place the hand irons on my-- put me in-- place me in hand irons, and there was a loop attached to it in between the two cuffs.

Sometimes it was a chain cuff, sometimes it was the hinge cuff.They had different ones for different times, and the belt was attached, and then they would-- if it was just the one hand, they would tell me to put the other hand out after one was placed in, then, and then I would have-- they would instruct me to pull myself in.They would hold the belt.

Then, I would spin around.They would instruct me to spin around.So, that they could put the belt.So, I would do an about face movement, and then they would, you know, put the belt on, and instruct me.

And, then after the belt was done, they would instruct me to put my knees up on the rack sometimes with my face on the wall-- sometimes I would have it stood up. I just waited for the direct instruction, which depended on the guard, and then they would place the leg restraints on me, while I am kneeling on the rack.

And, then they would hold-- they would hold the belt.And, they would hold-- they would usually like grab the belt-- the slack on the belt and hold onto that.And, I would get pulled up.Then I would be standing erect, with at least one guard holding me. And, I would be escorted outside the cell.

Defense (Coombs)

Now I want to just cover-- there were two time periods that you were on suicide risk, correct?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, I just want to briefly cover the conditions of suicide risk, and then we will compare that with how that differed to POI, 'prevention of injury'. Okay?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So, real briefly, the times that you were on suicide risk, were you subject to constant observation?

Pfc. Manning

On suicide risk, yes.Constant, directly outside of the door observation, so, what they called line of sight observation, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how was that accomplished?

Pfc. Manning

There would be a guard, usually, and E2, usually a Private, or Private First Class for the Marines, would sit there, and he would have a clip board or at Marine Corps Base Quantico they had a green book in which they wrote down updates on whatever was going on.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, did you speak to the guard that was sitting outside of your cell during this time?

Pfc. Manning

Only if I needed something, sir.I was not authorized to have any conversation with him.

Defense (Coombs)

And, you said that they would write down things, do you know what they would be writing down?

Pfc. Manning

I know now through discovery, but I was not privy to that [missed word].

Defense (Coombs)

Were you ever woken up during the night during this time period?

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Defense (Coombs)

And, why would you be woken up?

Pfc. Manning

Well, sometimes if they felt that there view was obstructed or seeing my face, while I am sleeping, then they would knock on the-- they would knock on the door of the cell or on the grating of the cell and instruct me to respond in some manner.

I would sit up or move my face, depending on if I had a blanket obstructing my view or turned over so they could see my face, or some-- They just wanted-- they wanted to see my face in particular.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, why would you be covering your face, or turning your face away from the door?

Pfc. Manning

Well, when I am sleeping in-- as I am sleeping in 191 or 192, I have the light that's directly outside.

I didn't intend-- I mean I would often try to sleep so that, that way I wouldn't get woken up.I mean even if it meant, you know, having the bright light, you know, it seemed bright at that angle at least, you know, with that light coming in.

I would try and fall asleep like that, but I mean I ended up always rolling over, or covering myself just as I am asleep, and then that would lead me to being woken up.

I mean, on Suicide Risk it happened sometimes two or three times a night.

Defense (Coombs)

Where did you eat your meals when you were on suicide risk?

Pfc. Manning

I ate every meal inside of the cell, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what were you permitted to have inside of your cell, when you were on suicide risk?

Pfc. Manning

I was permitted to have-- I don't recall exactly what clothing I was authorized a part from my-- I think I had a T-Shirt, underwear, and socks on the very first time that I was ever on Suicide Risk.

And, then I had shorts, but they were-- they were Army standard PT shorts, but the loop inside of it had been taken out.So, it was just the elastic portion.So, they were modified PT shorts.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you permitted to have your prescription glasses?

Pfc. Manning

For the first two nights no, sir.For the first two days I was there, no sir.Whenever I was in the cell, I did not have glasses.

Defense (Coombs)

And, do you need your glasses in order to see?

Pfc. Manning

I cannot see past four or five inches with detail.

I mean, maybe with some practice, I can see depth of objects, large objects and [missed word] some things, but I cannot make out detail.So, no.I just can't.I can't see without my glasses [slight laugh at himself].

Defense (Coombs)

And, so for the first you said, you couldn't see.How many hours of the day were you required to be without your glasses?

Pfc. Manning

Anytime I was inside the cell and not doing-- filing out paperwork.I mean again this is the very first-- I had just arrived at the facility, but they got frustrated because i couldn't see-- I couldn't see the rank on their collars.

I remember that, so.They authorized me to wear glasses during the daytime at some point, a few days later.

Defense (Coombs)

And, why were they frustrated that they could not see the rank on their collars?

Pfc. Manning

It's the Marine Corps.

And, you always-- I mean every single time you spoke to somebody, you used their rank or sir or ma'am, depending on-- or Chief for Chief Warrant Officer or you know Commissioned Officer, or what not, sir.

So, the customs and courtesies are never ending, and they expect that at all times.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you allowed to have writing materials in your cell when you were on suicide watch?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall being able to.

I don't remember what the handling instructions were for the first couple days I was-- I had only just arrived, so.On reception status you are not authorized.

So, I was on hybrid status for first week, I think, where I was on a reception status, as well as suicide risk.

So, I would have only-- I would only be authorized the rule book, what they called the 'Rules and Regulations' for the facility.It's a Brig Order.

Defense (Coombs)

You said then after the first coupled of days, then they did let you have your glasses?

Pfc. Manning

They did, sir--

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so let's--

Pfc. Manning

I remember now it was the rank and the fact that I can read with them, but I have to put it up to my face.

I am very near sighted.So, they were worried because I have this book that was like right up to my face, and I talked to-- I think it was Gunnery Sergeant Blenis about that.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, let's talk about what your life was like during the period of time, that first time when you were on suicide watch.

So, essentially you got there through 29 July to the time that they took you off 11 August--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--okay? Can you tell us what your average day was like during that time period?

Pfc. Manning

Certainly. I-- They would announce reveille. And, what is the end timeframe for that?If you could--

Defense (Coombs)

When you were taken off of suicide watch, 11 August?

Pfc. Manning

Okay. So, from my arrival to 11 August, I was inside of the cell.

They would announce reveille three times.'Reveille Reveille Reveille'Turn on the lights.

And, then they would place a-- they don't-- On Suicide Risk, they would sometimes authorize you limited access to a razor to shave.

So, I would shave my face with-- with a safety razor.And then return that.

And, then they would announce 'count'.There would be a-- sometimes-- sometimes there was enough time to do that hygiene-- shave your face-- before count.Sometimes there wasn't.

So, sometimes they would conduct count almost immediately following 'Reveille Reveille Reveille'

Defense (Coombs)

And--

Pfc. Manning

--and throughout the day they would do counts.They would deliver chow.And, then I would--I don't recall on suicide watch being authorized anything more than twenty minutes 'sunshine call'.So, they would take me out of the cell to go outside in full restraints for twenty minutes.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. So you went to sleep at 22 hundred, correct?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. That was the end of the day. Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, from zero five to 22 hundred, other than the twenty minutes 'sunshine call' outside of your cell, were you taken out of your cell?

Pfc. Manning

On reception status, no.So, for the first couple days, no.And--

Defense (Coombs)

What about for the suicide watch?

Pfc. Manning

The suicide watch, without the reception hybrid status, they would take me to 'sunshine call'.

And then on-- usually once a week I would be pulled out to see Gunnery Sergeant Blenis.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what about showers.Were you ever taken out for showers?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, that is the other thing.It is in the housing unit, so it is maybe fifteen meters from the exit to my cell.

Further out from, past the-- past the point where the sunlight is.

It's called a sunlight, right?The hole in the ceiling-- window-- and then you have the shower.Then, that was were I took my shower was fifteen or twenty minutes [missed word] from my cell.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how long were you provided to take a shower?

Pfc. Manning

Usually between five and ten minutes on suicide risk status with a guard standing directly outside of the shower, with line of sight on me.

There is no-- there is nothing obstructing the view between the outside of the shower-- the outside of the cell area containing the shower.

Defense (Coombs)

So, for the rest of the time that you are inside of your six by eight cell, where you permitted to lie down flat on the rack?

Pfc. Manning

Flat-- lie down flat on the rack?

Defense (Coombs)

--yeah, on your back?

Pfc. Manning

--on reception status, all hours were considered duty hours, so no.

The entire day you sat upright, with your legs on-- eventually the [missed word] of my legs being on the bed, but-- like an Indian style position. But depending on who the guard was.

And then, duty hours would be implemented after I was taken off of reception status. Duty hours being between zero five and 17 hundred to as late as 19 hundred during the weekdays, and during the holiday period, they still implemented early duty hours between zero seven and 10-- for the start of visitation period, and then they would re-implement that period, right after chow-- right after dinner chow.So, between 16 hundred to again 18 hundred.

Defense (Coombs)

So, if it were during the duty day, were you permitted to lie down on your rack?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. Definitely not.Unless you had-- there was a medical exception that I did have at night, towards the end, after I would take-- I would take the Ativan-- I forgot what it was-- Clonazepam-- Klonopin.So, I would take that and they would allow me to sleep after that.

Defense (Coombs)

So, if you lay down in your cell, and it was during the duty day, what would happen?

Pfc. Manning

You would be told not to do that.If you continued to do so, you would face disciplinary action including having a DA board.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you permitted to lean your back against the wall...?

Defense (Coombs)

No, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--during the duty day?

Pfc. Manning

Not during the duty hours, no.Unless you had a back-- you always had-- any exception status would be on the handling instructions, which were normally outside on a clipboard outside of the cell.

Defense (Coombs)

And, was that always the case during your entire time at Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. I want to go to POI, but before I do that if we could take a ten minute comfort break?

Judge Lind

Alright. And that enough for everybody?

Prosecution (Fein)

Ma'am, can we make it fifteen please?

Judge Lind

That is fine.Court is in recess until 15:30 or 2:30 p.m.

ALL RISE

ALL RISE

Judge Lind

Please be seated.This Article 39(a) session is called to order.Let the record reflect all parties present when the Court last recessed are again present in Court.Mr. Coombs?

Defense (Coombs)

Thank you, your Honor.Pfc. Manning, I remind you that you are still under oath.

Pfc. Manning

[missed]

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, let's talk about POI.Prevention of injury.Were you ever downgraded from suicide risk to prevention of injury?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir, I was.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when was this?

Pfc. Manning

Mid to late August. I don't recall-- I do not remember the exact date, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. Let's compare what your life was like on prevention of injury, as opposed to when you were on suicide risk.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

During this time, were you still on MAX as well?

Pfc. Manning

I will still on-- well, being on suicide risk or POI is an automatic that you are on MAX status.

Defense (Coombs)

That was your understanding?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. That was what Gunnery Sergeant Blenis explained to me.And from my reading of the facility rule book, it was implied.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so when you were on prevention of injury, were you still subjected to constant observation?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. But, it was not line of sight. It was through the observation booth window.

Defense (Coombs)

How often were the Brig guards checking on you when you were on prevention of injury?

Pfc. Manning

They would open the door, and poke their head out.And, sometimes they would step out completely, and check on me.

I described it as physically check on me.So, they have line of sight, and then they ask me verbally, 'Are you okay? How you doing? Are you doing good?'

So, I respond, 'Yes, Rank.Yes, Lance Corporal.Yes, Corporal. Yes, PFC.'

Defense (Coombs)

And during this time that you were on POI, with the-- were you ever woken up in the middle of--

Pfc. Manning

Not, nearly as frequently.Maybe once every few nights, but at last two or three times a week this occurred, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, was this also due to covering your head or obstructing their view in some way?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, and it wasn't intentional.I mean it was usually just I am just rolling over during the night, so that I just end up where they-- where the guard cannot see my entire face, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, where did you eat your meals when you are on POI?

Pfc. Manning

On prevention of injury it was the same arrangement.Where I would eat the meal in the cell, but I was given a plastic tray.

And, it was a metal spoon for the longest time.That is what I recall.So, I was given on metal spoon, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, were there any other detainees near you when you were on POI status?

Pfc. Manning

They were in special quarters.So, they weren't necessarily adjacent to me, or near to me.But, they would-- they would be-- there were some detainees that I could hear down on the same row.

And, certainly there was several detainees on a row on the other side of the observation booth, where there would be a large commotion.

I mean there was a lot of mingling and things and a lot of yelling.

So, I knew that they-- that other detainees were there.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you permitted to speak to other detainees that are on your same row?

Pfc. Manning

Technically I was, but it had to be in a low conversational tone, but if they are not near me-- I mean even if I am talking to someone-- whenever you don't have line of sight with anybody, so-- low conversational tone is-- was anything other than yelling, so, no.

I mean, but I was technically allowed to speak to other detainees, but in actually doing so I would be violating the conversational tone-- tone rules. So, in essence, no.

Defense (Coombs)

And, if you violated that rule by raising your voice, what would happen?

Pfc. Manning

They would open the door to the observation booth an tell me that I wasn't-- that I needed to-- that because of the distance between me and the other detainees or prisoners-- and I don't know what status the other people are, because I can't see them.You know, I am not allowed to talk to them.

They might be a different-- sometimes it was a different status, but it was always that they were too far away from me to be-- for me to have a conversation with them.

Defense (Coombs)

And, at this point, as I understand what you said earlier, you were initially provided kind of the standard mattress?Is that correct?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Again, much like the the green mattress that is there-- slightly-- it was slightly in better condition than that one in terms of it was more rigid-- wasn't flexible.

Defense (Coombs)

And, were you provided a pillow when you got downgraded to POI?

Pfc. Manning

No. I've never received a pillow as far as I am aware of , sir.

Defense (Coombs)

What did you start to do with your mattress due to the fact that you did not have a pillow?

Pfc. Manning

I would take the mattress and I would roll up one end slightly so that way I could put my head on it, and that way my head wasn't down.So, my head was elevated about another two inches, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did there come a time that they actually did provide you with a suicide mattress that had the built in pillow?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. They did.They gave me a different mattress.I think they ordered specially in December, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

December of 2010?

Pfc. Manning

December of 2010.Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, is that when you received it?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I received it as soon as it arrived.It was specially ordered to--

Defense (Coombs)

And--

Pfc. Manning

--basically that is what Chief Warrant Officer Averhart said.

Defense (Coombs)

And, I know you kind of described the difference between the mattress that we have as an appellate exhibit and the one that you received, but in general, how would you describe the comfort level of the suicide mattress that you were provided?

Pfc. Manning

It was the same as the regular mattress. So, the comfort level improved with the pillow, but not by a horrible-- a large amount.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you permitted to have regular sheets or blankets once you were placed on POI?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. I have never had sheets or blankets-- well, apart from the POI blankets.

Defense (Coombs)

And, these POI blankets, you said that they were rigid.How were they as far as keeping you warm at night?

Pfc. Manning

They do not retain heat.If you have two of them, I think, that the air in between them insulates a little bit better, but I didn't-- during the summertime it was very cold, and they didn't-- I mean they would usually come-- I digress a little, but they usually overcompensated the temperature.So, if it was hot outside, it would be intensely cool inside.So-- so it was usually cool in the wintertime as well.But, they would issue a second blanket in the wintertime.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Were you permitted to have personal items in your cell, once you were placed on POI?

Pfc. Manning

By personal items, if you mean like hygiene items and extra uniforms and things--

Defense (Coombs)

Right.

Pfc. Manning

--no. I was-- if I asked for toilet paper, and I needed it, then I would have access to toilet paper or just toilet paper during the day.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so I guess, let's just continue on that one question for the toilet paper. If you needed to use the toilet, and you needed toilet paper, how would you ask for it?

Pfc. Manning

I would stand up to the front of the door-- standing at parade rest, and I would-- and I would announce through to the escorts in the observation room-- I would announce, "Lance Corporal, detainee Manning requests permission to use toilet paper"

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so--

Pfc. Manning

--or "...permission to receive toilet paper."

Defense (Coombs)

You are at the front of your cell.You would announce that--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--and then what happens?

Pfc. Manning

They would sometimes come out if they weren't too busy, and then they would retrieve toilet paper.It was either in the cell adjacent to me where other belongings were, or they would have a roll of toilet paper inside the observation room to give to me.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay, so, when you were in the cell, and you were asking for that--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--did you ever wait in order to get the toilet paper?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I would stand at parade rest at the front of the door, until they would either see me.I am still standing there, and then they would respond. Sometimes if they didn't hear me, they would see me there, and know that I was wanting a request for something, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay, once you received it, again there was nothing blocking their view of you when you were using the toilet?

Pfc. Manning

Correct. That is correct, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And so, once you received the toilet paper, used it, then if you had extra toilet paper, what did you do with it?

Pfc. Manning

I always gave the toilet paper back to the guard.I did not keep it.As, soon-- as soon as I was finished with the toilet paper I had to give it back to the guard.

Sometimes, if they would go back to the observation booth, then I would set it on the feed tray for them to pick up.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, if you wanted to wash your hands, then, at the sink, what would you have to do?

Pfc. Manning

I would have to do the same process.So, I would stand at the front of the cell, and request for soap from my soap dish.It was a lot more-- it was a lot less of a priority.So, I didn't often receive that.I didn't always ask for it.

Defense (Coombs)

So, there were times where you would asked for it, and they never gave it to you?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, Sir.Were-- I would stand at parade rest there, and sometimes-- and then I would just-- they would say that they are gonna get it, and then they didn't. And, then I would just sit down and not worry about it.

Defense (Coombs)

Now other personal items.What else were you allowed to have in your cell other than, you-- I guess your clothes and your glasses at that point?

Pfc. Manning

The only-- the items that I had were I had a mattress, POI blanket or blankets depending on the temperature outside.For a period of time I had flip flops.So, socks, underwear, shorts, flip flops, and that would be all the physical items that are not attacked to the cell itself.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you permitted to have reading material in your cell?

Pfc. Manning

I don't remember the exact instructions on what-- what I was authorized to read-- when-- but I was eventually given the privilege to read, although the library collection was-- I mean it wasn't-- it was fairly limited.So, I didn't have a lot of interest in a lot of books that they had, so I ordered some.

Defense (Coombs)

What did you order to read?

Pfc. Manning

I ordered books that I-- and that I in particular have an interest in reading or had read before and wanted to read again, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

How did you get those books?

Pfc. Manning

Those were special ordered through-- by my family and would arrive in pre-selected packages so that the facility would know that they were coming ahead of time.

Defense (Coombs)

And, do you recall what books you were reading at that time?

Pfc. Manning

I read a lot of philosophy books-- a lot of history books.I am more of a non-fiction reader, though I do like real-- I like realistic fiction like John Grisham, Tom Clancy sort of present day real-- realistic events-- that type of fiction.

But, more of a non-fiction reader, so.Brian Greene is a good author.Richard Dawkins would be an interesting author, sir.Those are the types of books that I like to read when I have recreational time, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, were you allowed to have all those books in your cell at that point?

Pfc. Manning

No. They were in the cell adjacent to me.I was authorized to read books, and only read the book.So, I would sit there and I would be reading the book.

If I was not reading the book, then the guard would come out of the cell or announce, you know, ask me if I was still reading the book.

And, he would ask me if I was done.If I wasn't reading it-- like even if I-- even if my eyes were taken away from it-- like just to rest my eyes-- they would open the door and ask me if I was still reading the book.

Defense (Coombs)

So, if you weren't actively reading the book, the book would be taken away--

Pfc. Manning

--and looking like I was actively reading the book, yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

--they would ask me-- they would ask to retrieve the book.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you allowed to exercise in your cell now that you are on POI?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. Not-- not-- I mean there were ways around it in terms of not being quite exercising, but--

Defense (Coombs)

What did you try to do to get around the exercise prohibition?

Pfc. Manning

There was a lot of things-- there was a lot of things.I would practice various dance moves-- and dancing is not technically exercising, as far as they were concerned.It wasn't unauthorized on the handling instructions.So, I did that sometimes.I would do resistance training with my arms--

Defense (Coombs)

What do you mean by resistance training?

Pfc. Manning

It is where you're using-- where you're doing-- where you're putting effort against your muscles, but you are not-- you don't necessarily have a weight or anything.

So, it is like weight training, but without the weights, because you don't-- because you might not have access to them.So it tones muscles mostly.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what else would you do?

Pfc. Manning

Anything. Any kind of body movement or pacing around.Walking around.Shuffling.Just any type of movement.

I mean there wasn't a lot to do, so I would just try to move around as much as I could.Even, if it was just-- even if it was just minor movements every so often-- just keep moving.That way I can keep the blood flowing, and stay awake.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, you indicated that, that was one form-- that the dancing was once form of pseudo exercise.That the guards would not stop you from doing.

Pfc. Manning

Correct. It was not-- it was not a regulation exercise as far as they're concerned-- like crunch-- like stomach crunches or pull ups or sit ups or anything like that.

And, it wasn't-- it was up to interpretation.I mean I guess dancing is not-- they didn't allow whistling or singing or anything like that.So, there was a lot of things-- I mean they were very-- if it wasn't-- if it was written that it was unauthorized on the handling instructions, then they would go by that and nothing else.

Defense (Coombs)

So, when you say you were doing anything to stay awake.What was it like to be in your cell like that-- for that period of time?

Pfc. Manning

It was pretty draining.I can't think of another word.Just tiring.You are just-- if you are-- I spent a lot of time, looking for things to stay active and to keep my mind from going back to a state similar to Kuwait.

I didn't want to-- I tried to feel as much like I wasn't trapped in it-- like a cage or a cell.I tried to feel like I wasn't trapped in there-- that I still know where I am. I know my environment.

I would just try to stay active and I would tryto keep from falling asleep, because they-- that was the rule. You were not allowed to sleep or look like-- even the appearance of sleep was considered sleeping.So, you couldn't close your eyes or anything like that.So, I would move around.Get blood pumping, instead of-- just to keep myself from sleeping-- and drink-- and I drank a lot of water, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Let's talk about some other restrictions on POI.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you still only getting twenty minutes of 'sunshine call' when you were placed on POI from suicide sisk?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I was authorized twenty minutes. I don't-- I assume [missed a few words] there was a discussion at least of an upgrade to possibly thirty minutes by Gunnery Sergeant Blenis in October timeframe, but I don't know if that was ever [missed word].I don't remember.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you know when you were upgraded, I guess from twenty minutes of 'sunshine call' to one hour of rec call.

Pfc. Manning

Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart came to see at one point and said he was-- that as long as it wasn't-- as long as I didn't do anything-- stupid is the word that I can think of, but I don't want to say that, that is what he said-- but as long as I wasn't doing anything to look like I was harming myself or anything like that, then he would allow me to have more recreation privileges.

But, the second that I did not-- didn't comply or have anything, then it would go back to the way-- he would change the handling instructions back to the way they were before.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So, when you were taken on-- do you recall the time period that was?

Pfc. Manning

I want to say December, because it was-- it was before-- it was in the week or two preceding or right before my birthday, which is December 17th.

And, I remember that I spoke with you the week after that to announce it.So, I don't-- that is what I remember, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. And, so when you were taken now for your-- I guess for the twenty minutes of 'sunshine call', let's talk about what you did from 29 July to basically December timeframe.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

My understanding is that you had two places to go inside rec and outside rec, is that right?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, depending on outdoor conditions, the temperature outside was one of the factors and whether there was icing or raining or anything.Then, I went-- that determined whether I was at an indoor recreation area or an outdoor recreation area.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. So when you were taken to an outdoor recreation area, for your twenty minutes of 'sunshine call'--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--what were you doing?

Pfc. Manning

For 'sunshine call', the twenty minute period, I would be taken outside in full restraints.They would have one or two guards.Always at least one guard holding me, and we would walk usually in some kind of-- like around in circles or on figure eights.Try to change of the shape by their request, you know, to move around.I would get some walk and see some sun, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what about indoor rec, what would you do for your twenty minutes of indoor rec?

Pfc. Manning

The same thing towards-- in-- during the autumn timeframe, I was still going outside, even when it was like there was a light mist.

But, around-- before Thanksgiving, they cleared out one of the-- they kept-- they kept describing it as a chapel-- I don't know anything about that, but they changed it to an indoor recreation area, and I would be-- and I was transported to that indoor recreation area, and then I walked around with the guard, inside that bay area.

Defense (Coombs)

Still in restraints?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, for the 'sunshine call', yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you permitted to wear shoes during the time?

Pfc. Manning

Without laces.I had tennis shoes that I received through my command.They were my tennis shoes from Fort Drum.I don't know how they got them.I was surprised to see them again.They removed the laces from them and they would-- I mean they are at my ankles so they would not stay on my feet.So, I wore my Army issue tan boots for the ACUs without laces, because they-- the tongue is built in so it just stays on your feet.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Now, when you were increased to one hour of recreation call now--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--what would you do for your recreation call outside?

Pfc. Manning

This is recreation call so there-- for recreation call I didn't have restraints. They would remove the restraints for outdoor.There was a feed tray.They would close me into the pen area.

They call it the bullpen, which was maybe a third of the size of an NBA basketball court, and they would remove my restraints through the chain link bullpen feed tray.And, I would walk around.

They wouldn't let me run for the longest time, and it wasn't a good idea either, because I was wearing boots, because they didn't let me have laces.

At some point, I got laces for my shoes.I don't recall when or how, but I was able to do a little jogging then, and play when they gave me a basketball, so.

There was a hoop.It was probably about eight feet, so it wasn't regulation, but it was a basketball hoop-- I could use.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. And, let's talk about the indoor rec then.What could you do on the indoor rec?

Pfc. Manning

There was less that I could do on the indoor rec.They would take me into the indoor recreation area.They would have a chair.They would set me on a chair.They would remove my restraints.

This was the only time that they would actually remove my restraints, while they were not going through a feed tray or anything.So, they were a lot more careful about how they did that.

And, then-- I was always-- I would have to stay about ten or fifteen feet away from the guards, if I wasn't-- they wouldn't let me be near the guards during that time.

And, then I was in sort of an area-- and I always have three or four guards-- and always an Non Commissioned Officer, usually and E5 or E6, would be watching me while I am in there.And, I could walk around.

There was a-- there was some spinners, which are a bike with some resistance, which is set with a screw, and we adjusted positions. Some guards authorize me to utilize that if I asked for permission to use it, and they did.Used that for cardio.And, there was a-- again, permission was required every time, but I would use the pull-up bars and-- they had a set of pull-up bars-- and I would use those-- use my own body weight for exercises.

They also had a mat so I could do sit-ups and pushups.There was on the sides of the room, there were electronic exercise equipment that were there.

From my understanding, I was told that most of it didn't work, and that-- but they didn't want me to touch anything electronic, whatsoever.So, I wasn't allowed to touch the-- or be near the electronic equipment-- the a-- like a-- they had treadmills and weight lifting equipment-- but if it plugged into something or had any sort of computer, they didn't allow me to touch it.They were concerned about that.

Defense (Coombs)

So, if it were a say a bright, sunny day and they took you to outdoor rec--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Pfc. Manning

--and if you wanted to, could you just kind of sit down on the ground, or maybe lay down on the ground, to just take in some sun?

Pfc. Manning

Definitely not.No laying down.I always had to be doing something, whether it was walking or moving around. If they did not-- if I was not moving around they would ask me if I wanted my rec time secured, whether I wanted to fill out a 'voluntary statement'.I would be-- at first I thought-- but I just went with it.

I always would walk around.I would at least walk around in like circles, figure eights, S formations. I made up all kinds of different shapes that I could walk around in, while I had the boot restriction or the lace restriction.

And, then I was able to play basketball and things, but it was a lot more maneuverable with a-- and they were less concerned about me falling or getting injured in anyway without the laces [missed a word].

Defense (Coombs)

Now, were you-- on POI were you permitted to have correspondence time, where you could write to family members?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I think it was an hour long. It usually clashed with-- I eventually got TV privileges.So--

Judge Lind

You got what privileges?

Pfc. Manning

Television privileges, Ma'am.

Defense (Coombs)

So, you got-- it clashed with the TV privileges?

Pfc. Manning

Right, so there was a-- there was a period of time where it was either television or correspondence, or the combination of the two. I don't know. So, I was authorize my legal document to see and have access to legal material including some of the print-offs of discovery material, and a notebook, and I recall one pen.

Defense (Coombs)

And, were you allowed to call your family during the time that you were on POI?

Pfc. Manning

Technically yes.There was a telephone.I never used the telephone that they had for the regular phone calls, because there is a collect call situation.

I don't-- I never really got the whole gist of how it worked exactly.I was given a pin number, although, my pin number didn't work for it.So, they would-- what it was, was there was like a telephone from like an old TV-- or not TV-- or telephone booth-- like that kind of telephone, but it was on a cart.

And, then they had a long cable that would plug into the wall in the observation room.

And, then you would use it, and it went to a system, and you pick up the phone, and you enter your pin number and a bunch of other things, but it was only collect call out.

And, you had to make sure that the-- that, that phone number was authorized on the list of phone numbers.It was a complicated process, and I don't recall ever being able to call anybody, because most-- one, I had issues with the pin number.Two, I had issues with the numbers being placed in the system.

And, three, I was-- I was aware that most of the phone-- most cell phone companies don't accept this type of collect call.

So, almost everybody at the facility-- and I have been told by Gunnery Sergeant Blenis that most people weren't able to make phone calls using that system, because of all those little quirks and complications with it.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you aware that the telephone calls that you were making were being recorded?

Pfc. Manning

Using those-- that-- using that phone system they would have been recorded-- I also-- there was a little bit of-- I don't really want to call my aunt and have every word scrutinized, you know, like that-- like on her end.

So, I would tell her-- I felt it was best just to leave my aunt alone, and leave some of my friends alone in that respect.

Defense (Coombs)

During the time that-- based upon the fact they had recordings of your calls, you were able to occasionally call your aunt or call family members?

Pfc. Manning

No, the system-- not using the phone system that was available for me on those-- during off duty hours.

I never used-- I don't recall ever being able to use that system.They had the same phone system that we used for our attorney phone calls on-- they gave us a courtesy phone call, because some of the people were having issues with the phones that they authorized.

There was a point with a-- would take all-- I was told that all the other detainees had this happening as well.But, they took me out of the cell on Thanksgiving day of 2010.I don't recall the day, I know it was a Thursday.

But, and they took me in for-- in that area, and they asked me.They had to check with the phone number and everything, but I made a phone call to my aunt.It was a ten minute phone call. The guards were standing right next to me.

And, I told her that I was good, and that I loved her and everything else.And, then I called-- and then for Christmas eve, I was given the same opportunity for-- they called it a 'courtesy phone call'.Again, ten minutes, and I called Tyler.

Those were the only two phone numbers that-- I actually knew three phone numbers, including yours, sir.But, those are the only three phone numbers that I had memorized, so.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. Now, were you allowed to have visitors at Quantico, now that you were on POI?

Pfc. Manning

I was authorized visitors.I had to fill out paperwork to place them on the visitation list, and they had to be approved.

So, they had to have like background checks, and things like that-- I don't know what was entailed with that, but I guess what Gunnery Sergeant Blenis-- Gunnery Sergeant Blenis, by the way, just he was my main conduit with the-- for communications through the facility, so.

Defense (Coombs)

He was your Brig counselor?

Pfc. Manning

He was the Brig counselor, so.He was the overall-- he was the overarching supervisor--- NCOIC of the counseling program.There were three counselors, but he wasmy assignment counselor.He assigned himself as my counselor.

Defense (Coombs)

So, how often were you permitted to have visitors come?

Pfc. Manning

They were authorized on weekdays-- or no, weekends.They were authorized on weekends from eleven, no from ten o'clock-- no, from twelve noon until 15 hundred. So, three hours on weekends.

Defense (Coombs)

Anytime on the weekdays?

Pfc. Manning

I think holidays-- they treated those as weekends, and I think they had a holiday schedule, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And where would these visits take place?

Pfc. Manning

These would take place in a non contact booth.They were-- booth was-- right at the partition between the front of the facility and the rest of the facility.So, that is where they took place.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you were taken to see your visitors in the non-contact booth, were the restraints removed from you?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. If it was an attorney visit again, I had one-- I sometimes had one hand removed for writing.

Defense (Coombs)

How many hours of the day, that you are now on POI would you-- would you say that you were inside your six by eight foot cell?

Pfc. Manning

Can you just rephrase that question, sir?

Defense (Coombs)

Now that you went from suicide risk to POI, how many hours of the day do you think in general you were inside of the cell?

Pfc. Manning

Roughly the same amount.I think I got another-- there might be an additional five minutes-- five minutes for being out, because I was given a little bit more shower time.

Defense (Coombs)

And, a little bit more rec time?

Pfc. Manning

Eventually, yes sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, in your estimation what was the difference from your perspective of suicide risk to POI?Can you tell Colonel Lind?

Pfc. Manning

Very little.In terms of the effect-- there were-- there were distinctions, but I always had a guard watching me.

I mean it was just a question of whether or not it was through the glass window or not. And, I had some additional clothing for POI, for a period of time, so, until March of 2011.

Defense (Coombs)

So, other than that, your estimation is that it is roughly the same?

Pfc. Manning

Well, yes. I mean the distinction is so low that I wouldn't really-- I mean it's a big-- it is sort of a big difference, in terms of from my perspective.

I didn't have to have somebody sit right outside of my cell all the time-- directly outside of my cell.There was at least, the appearance of them not being there, but they were still sitting there.So, it was roughly the same.So, it was roughly the same.I would say ninety per cent the same.

Defense (Coombs)

And, did you know that Chief Averhart and later Chief Barnes were submitting weekly reports up through the chain of command?

Pfc. Manning

I had no idea sir, until I-- actually three weeks ago when you told me that.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you know that your counselor, Gunnery Sergeant Blenis, was filling out information for these weekly reports?

Pfc. Manning

I found out some of that information through what he put into the system and what we got the print out from the Article 138 complaint, but that was towards the January, February timeframe that I found that out.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what was the role of the Brig counselor from your perspective?

Pfc. Manning

I saw him as my conduit-- my communication person to the facility apart from the standard guard, where I always standing at parade rest and doing exactly what I am told at all times.

I could speak to him on a-- at level.He would relax.He didn't wear a belt.So, he--All the guards wore a duty belt, and a [cuffer?] at all times.

And, they never left that role as long as they wore a duty belt and the cap, but he didn't wear a duty belt, so he could relax, and I could relax and talk to him at level.

Defense (Coombs)

How often would you see Gunnery Sergeant Blenis?

Pfc. Manning

I saw him at least once a week for a long period of time.I think there was a period of time in which he went on leave, so-- and then TAD [Temporary Additional Duty] for, I don't know. I forget. I think it is TAD for the Marines Corps, but there was a period of time in which he left, and Staff Sergeant Jordan covered down.

He was the Army liaison officer as well as a counselor.So, I would speak to him in that role, but Gunnery Sergeant Blenis was the-- I think it is Master Sergeant Blenis now.He got promoted, so.

Defense (Coombs)

And, where would you--

Pfc. Manning

[missed]

Defense (Coombs)

--that's fine.Where would you see Master Sergeant Blenis?

Pfc. Manning

Master Sergeant Blenis would visit me in the cell at least twice a week normally to see me.Not necessarily talk to me, but, you know, 'Are you doing okay?' 'Yes, Gunnery Sergeant Blenis' or '[missed], Gunnery Sergeant Blenis.'And, then he would pull me out, and I would be escorted to his office.And, I would sit in his office, and he would talk to me, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

When you were taken to his office, were your restraints removed?

Pfc. Manning

My restraints were never removed outside of that-- in that capacity, so, no. They were not removed, so.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how long would your sessions last with then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis?

Pfc. Manning

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis.I spoke to him between twenty minutes to-- usually at least twenty minutes to forty five minutes to [missed word]-- at most an hour.I mean sometimes-- whenever-- whenever he was-- early on I was able to talk to him more.So-- So it was almost an hour for the early portion.

Defense (Coombs)

And what would the two of you talk about?

Pfc. Manning

We would just banter.I mean, I used the opportunity to have-- to talk to somebody that wasn't-- that wasn't wearing a duty belt.So, I could talk to him as a person and not have this guard inmate relationship.

You know, I thought-- I thought he was a fairly level person.So, I could talk to Master Sergeant Blenis.So, I talked to him about all kinds of stuff. I mean, he had an interest in college sports, so.I like college basketball, so. That was-- that was one thing that we often talked about.

Defense (Coombs)

And, based upon your interaction, what did you think of Master Sergeant Blenis?

Pfc. Manning

Master Sergeant Blenis is a very nice.He is a very nice person.I really like Master Sergeant Blenis.I think he-- I think he is a-- I think he is a level headed guy-- extraordinary Marine, sir.I have a high opinion of Master Sergeant Blenis.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you trust him?

Pfc. Manning

I did-- for a period of time-- I trusted Master Sergeant Blenis, yes.

Defense (Coombs)

During the July 2010 to December 2010 time frame, did then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis ever tell you that you were doing anything wrong?

Pfc. Manning

No, and I would-- I was always asking, you know, 'How am I doing?,' you know, 'How would you...' As you know, I like to be rated sometimes and I like to get an idea of where I am on things, you know, 'Give me an A, B, C, D,' you know.

He would usually give me an 'A' rating for whatever I was doing. Or, sometimes I would get a percentage, but-- or points or stars, or however, you know, whichever [missed], but I was always asking what I could do, and how--

The big problem or the big issue that would always come up is my status.You know, and during that time period I would ask him, and he would say, 'Well,' you know, 'whenever the doctors,' and he was referring to the psychiatrists, 'felt comfortable and would recommend me to come off of the prevention of injury status, then I could possibly get off of that and maybe see about,' you know, 'getting more privileges and maybe doing some work details and things.'

Defense (Coombs)

And, when do you think the earliest time period you started asking him about, you know, 'Hey, what do I need to do to get off of POI?' or 'How am I doing...?'

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean at first I wasn't asking him to take me off of POI.I mean that wasn't how it worked.I would-- I would-- He would bring it up.He would bring up, 'How's it going with' you know, 'the docs?'

He referred to them-- Master Sergeant Blenis would refer to them as the 'docs'. I mean I would say, 'It's Captain Hocter'So, I don't want to degrade him or anything.But, you know, he would always ask me how I was doing with him, sir.

And, I would say, you know, 'Things seem to be going okay,' you know.And, I would tell him how things were going, and I would ask him how from the facility standpoint, how he felt through-- obviously I was asking him directly how the facility was feeling about that issue.

And, he would always-- whenever I did start asking him, which was probably around mid-September I started asking about it, because I had been on suicide watch for over two months at that point, including the time in Kuwait, and I felt that was odd and unusual.

It didn't seem normal from my vantage point, and the guards were often-- offline talking about the fact that I was on suicide watch for a long period of time. And they would ask me-- they kept on asking me, 'When are you getting off of...' Well it wasn't suicide watch, but, '...off of POI?'They referred to it as just, 'suicide watch' or 'Manning Watch.'

Defense (Coombs)

And, so when you were talking with Gunnery Sergeant Blenis, you said, roughly in September time frame is when you started raising the issue of , 'When can I-- might be able to get off of this?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I remember my father visited me in early to mid September.Cause I know we were talking about the-- the issue with the-- I forgot the name of the man-- the pastor in Florida that was threatening to-- to burn the Koran on September 11th.

We were talking about that, and it hadn't happened yet, but so it was early September.And, it was around that timeframe, because I remember that particular conversation that we were talking about when my father visited, and that is when I raised the issue about the-- well he raised the issue about the POI-- asking about, 'How it is going with the docs?''What are they telling you?'and everything else.And, that was what Master Sergeant-- that is a quote from Master Sergeant Blenis, again--

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, and so then--

Pfc. Manning

--I am referring to the 'docs'.

Defense (Coombs)

--as the months increased, and now we are going into October, November, are you still having these conversations with Gunnery Sergeant Blenis?

Pfc. Manning

Pretty consistently.As-- I mean he would always ask about it if I didn't raise it.He would ask about, you know, 'What are they saying?' you know, and then I started asking-- it wasn't-- there was a certain point in time.

I don't-- I think it was October, but I started-- I started asking Captain Hocter what about, you know, why he wasn't recommending me to come off of POI.

Because I didn't know-- I didn't ask what his recommendations were to the facility or anything like that.He kept on saying that he was recommending me to comeoff of POI, and then I-- and then I was talking to Master Sergeant Blenis about the fact that I was still on POI, and that-- he kept on asking me about why the-- he kept on saying it was the 'docs' that were recommending to him that status, and not the facility.

So, I started to notice a discrepancy in what I was-- in the information that I was receiving, and that is whenever I became concerned.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you started, I guess, noticing a discrepancy between what you were hearing from Captain Hocter and what you were hearing from Master Sergeant Blenis--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--who did you raise the concern to next?

Pfc. Manning

After Master Sergeant Blenis?I raised it with you in particular.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how did you do that?

Pfc. Manning

Well I mean, I just said-- I explained that there was this-- I explained to you that there was this odd-- because there was this discrepancy with Captain Hocter-- I would talk to him-- I mean, at least once a week as well as Master Sergeant Blenis once a week.

And, I really wanted to get off of this status.I mean didn't feel it was-- I know I am not a doctor or anything, but I just-- I wanted to get off of this restrictive status, andat least be allowed to use, you know, sleep on, you know, sheet-- sheets-- with sheets and blanket, and everything else-- and have soap in my cell, and things like that.

Those were things-- those were high priority in my mind, in terms of improving my quality of life.So, I wanted-- that was a goal that had I set myself.And, I wanted to figure out how to achieve that goal. And, yes I raise it with you in particular, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what were you hearing from your legal counsel about that?

Pfc. Manning

There was various different options, and things like that.And, I was hesitant because you know, I was sort of scared but-- I didn't want to sound like I am complaining, or anything like that.

I don't like to sound like I am quote 'whining' unquote, you know.And, I didn't want to come off that way, so I informally-- I remember you stated-- I remember you stating-- you saying that you-- cause there were possible routes, but I still wanted to see, you know, if I could get, you know, the doctor, Captain Hocter, and the facility commander-- as I understood, who had that eventual-- eventual role of making that determination for POI status.

As I understood it in that way, try to get at them to meet in the middle somewhere and allow me to change status.So, I thought I could get that by, you know, by just informally, you know, asking them, 'Hey, what do I need to do?' and things like that.

Defense (Coombs)

And what was Gunnery Sergeant Blenis telling you, you were doing wrong at that point [missed two words]?

Pfc. Manning

Well, nothing.He didn't have any disciplinary-- in terms of disciplinary issues and things like that, he didn't raise any thing else.I have-- He just-- He kept on asking about, and this is a quote, you know, 'What are you saying to the docs?'I mean, 'Why? What is going on with the docs and with your status and everything else?'

So, you know, he didn't give-- I mean he said that I was doing great.One quote that Master Sergeant Blenis would often use was, 'I wish I had a hundred Mannings.'You know, 'You're great,' you know, 'You're not a disciplinary issue.You're not,' you know, from his perspective-- from his personal perspective, '...a flight risk,' or anything like that, so.He didn't-- He didn't-- I didn't get the vibe that he understood what was going on either.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so during this time period.How often were you seeing Captain Hocter?

Pfc. Manning

I think it was once a week at that point if not.I think at most one every three to five days.

Defense (Coombs)

And, where were your-- how long were your visits with Captain Hocter?

Pfc. Manning

At least-- they were usually an hour long-- sometimes more, because of that.I wanted to talk to somebody, so I could have someone to interact with, and I told him-- I said-- I could say to Captain Hocter in particular, 'I realize that you have other patients, and you have other issues to deal with.You have family.'He kept on saying he had a large family.He wouldn't specify whether it was kids or not, but I knew that he wanted to be with his family, and I-- but I just wanted somebody to talk to, and somebody to talk to that had a level where we could talk, as opposed to again the subordinate, you know, detainee/guard relationship.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you were talking with Captain Hocter, again what were your conversations about?

Pfc. Manning

In general, we would just start with current events.Because, I am a current events guy.I like to know-- it's what really grounds me in what is going on in the world, you know.

I remember the oil spill had finally been cleared up at one point in the Gulf. They finally stopped that, you know it was like a-- it is just things like that-- you know, that ground-- you know, from my perspective-- you know, where the world is and everything else. It makes-- the big world, as opposed to my little cell, you know-- worry about the much broader world, sir. I mean I'm sort of forgetting what the question was.

Defense (Coombs)

No, that's fine.What did you-- when you were with Captain Hocter, did you ever raise the issue of what Master Sergeant Blenis was telling you?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I would be like, 'Well the counselor is saying that'-- and, I told him that the counselor kept on saying that he was making-- then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis, Master Sergeant Blenis, was saying-- 'kept asking about your recommendations,' and I said-- and I kept on asking him, 'Well, why are you recommending me to stay on POI?' and he'd be like, 'I am not recommending you to stay on POI,' prevention of injury. And, then I wasn't sure who was telling the truth or where the information was.-- where the discrepancy was.

Defense (Coombs)

So, at that point you were not sure if you could trust Captain Hocter or Gunnery Sergeant Blenis?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I thought-- I thought Captain Hocter being-- I don't-- I don't-- you know, I was in a cell all day, so my mind wandered, and things like that.

But, I started wondering of Captain Hocter was telling the truth about his recommendations-- whether or not he was just trying to keep me feeling good about myself.

Defense (Coombs)

Between July 2010 and December of 2010 what was your life like, if you could describe it for the Judge, overall quality of life?

Pfc. Manning

Between? Can you repeat those time periods?

Defense (Coombs)

July 2010 to December 2010.

Pfc. Manning

Okay, so. It was-- I would say at first, it was a big improvement to arrive in-- in-- stateside-- big huge.

I felt great about being there, you know. I have a-- you know, the things I took for granted down range, you know-- or that I took for granted stateside before going downrange and coming back-- or [missed word] there again-- running water and air conditioning and things like that.

But, then-- then it started to-- as I was there longer-- and started to drain on me. I was getting more and more tired-- And, you know, I had access to my family now at this point, and access to some idea of what was going on in the world.

So, I started to-- I started to feel more-- like I was outside-- I started to feel like I was mentally going back into sort of Kuwait mode and that, that-- that lonely, you know-- dark black hole of a place, you know-- mentally I mean.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you ever go back to that place?

Pfc. Manning

No, I did not.I fought every inch to avoid the event horizon of that and accomplished that I think.

Defense (Coombs)

How difficult of that time was it for you?

Pfc. Manning

Being in a...?

Defense (Coombs)

Just having that struggle, how difficult was that for you?

Pfc. Manning

It was easier over time, sir. Before-- before the 2011 threshold.

So, by-- by Christmas time I was feeling a little bit better.Just, I mean-- I mean, I am not a big fan of that timeframe just cause it is the solstice and its really dark and I like the light-- or like sunshine and things like that, sir.

I am not a big fan of winter but that is why I don't really like that timeframe, but.

But, you know, I wasn't getting depressed or anything.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Do you recall Captain Hocter placing you on POI during that timeframe because he was worried about you getting depressed?

Pfc. Manning

I was-- something about-- I mean, I know you testified yesterday about that-- there was the twitter incident, as one of the-- as the DBS [Duty Brig Supervisor] referred to it at the time.

He asked me if I was alive-- [missed a few words] and he was like, 'Oh yeah, there is a report on twitter that you're dead.'I was like, 'I am not dead' to the Duty Brig Supervisor at the time.

And then he left, and I then I think it was a couple days later that Captain Hocter brought it up, but he had-- I don't know-- I don't know when I was placed on POI before that, but I just kind of chuckled that after I found out more information about that report or whatever it was-- and I didn't hear about it or anything.

I knew that they had taken away TV privileges, but they often would change-- they would often change the schedule, so that way I couldn't see current events programs or watch news and things like that.

I always tried to-- to figure out how I can get the-- get the news type programs on-- things like that, you know-- in terms of the schedule-- and schedule of calls and things, but they would avoid me watching, you know, those types of shows, sir.

And, they-- they-- they just plain removed the television at that point, and I was-- I wasn't happy about that, but I thought it was for a completely different reason.

I thought is was just a total misunderstanding on their part about me having access to a TV,

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Now let's talk about some of the behavior that the Brig apparently documented of yours.And, I want from your perspective to tell the Judge why you were doing it and what you were thinking.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

You were observed sword fighting imaginary characters in your cell.Do you recall that?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean I certainly do something that looks like that on occasion.

Defense (Coombs)

And, why were you doing that?

Pfc. Manning

Again, just bored, you know there is not a lot going on.There is not a lot to do.

And, I know that the-- I knew that the guard was watching, so I didn't-- if he didn't have a problem with it in terms of opening-- in terms of opening the door and, you know, coming out and poking his head out and saying, 'Stop doing that,' then I didn't-- then it usually wasn't an issue.I didn't-- from my-- from my vantage point.

But, I admit it.I could do things that look like that.I mean, from my-- I don't know-- I don't know if I was imagining that I was sword fighting, but I certainly did actions that looked like that.

Defense (Coombs)

What about being observed lifting imaginary weights in your cell and displaying actual strain and exertion when you are doing that?

Pfc. Manning

Well, if you do it a lot, I mean, I think that is resistance training.I have no idea if that is what it is or not. I mean I don't know-- I don't know when that was-- that particular incident was-- if there was an incident report or anything.But, for that, I haven't seen it. But a--

Defense (Coombs)

--were you ever told by the guards to stop doing that?

Pfc. Manning

No. I was asked-- I remember Gunnery Sergeant-- then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis stated something to that effect and I explained it to him, but nothing was ever brought up with that.

Defense (Coombs)

What about staring in the mirror and making faces at yourself?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. The most entertaining thing in there was the mirror. [laughs] It interacts with-- you can interact with yourself in there.So, I spent-- I spent quite a lot of time at the mirror.

Defense (Coombs)

And, again why were you doing that?

Pfc. Manning

Boredom. Just sheer, complete, out of my mind boredom.

Defense (Coombs)

There also is a report of you being observed licking the bars of your cell while you were apparently sleepwalking. Do you recall that?

Pfc. Manning

I have no idea what that is about.I don't.

But, again, I don't know if you have an incident report on that.I haven't seen any discovery or anything.I have seen references to it.

I don't have any specific knowledge to something of that effect, but I do recall sort of similar along those lines I guess, not sleep walking but-- television call on weekends was usually extended an hour after taps.

So, you still had access to the TV, and sometimes I would watch TV after lights out.So, I would have the TV there at a low volume.So, that way it doesn't keep people awake.

If that was authorized, and I was taking-- again-- I don't remember if it was clonazepam or Klonopin-- which one of those it was-- but I was taking that and it would make me drowsy.

So, I remember there is a-- the bars are cross thatched.They are a thatched iron bar type thing, so I would have to put my face close up to the-- to the grating to see the TV, and sometimes I would doze off while I was doing it.

And, I remember it looked like I was-- I remember Corporal-- it Corporal Sanders that stopped me at one point, and he said that, 'Don't eat the bars!' you know, 'They are not eatable.'

He said something to that effect. So, I stepped away from-- so I leaned back and I went away from the bars.I don't know anything about that-- I don't know if they are the same incident at all, sir.I speculate.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, then there was another incident of you playing peek-a-boo with yourself in the cell mirror or you also playing peek-a-boo with the guards in the observation booth.Do you recall that?

Pfc. Manning

I was never told anything about that except by Master Sergeant Blenis after the fact, and then I said, you know, I am not-- I realize that-- I do things in the mirror don't always look-- I mean, I don't know how it looks but, the mirror was the only interactive entertainment thing, sir.

It wasn't like I was seeing somebody else in the mirror or anything like that. [laughs] It is clearly me.

Sometimes I'd make funny faces just to-- just to do something in front of the mirror. I don't know if that's-- I don't know if I was playing peek-a-boo with myself, but I was certainly would, you know, look different angles at, you know, my face and things in terms of shaving and also other stuff-- and you know just general care and wear and tear, and looking at myself in the mirror, because there is not a lot else to do.

Defense (Coombs)

Did any of the guards ever express any concern directly to you about any of this behavior?

Pfc. Manning

Nothing specific.If there was something-- if I was doing something that concerned them, they would usually open the door immediately, and-- and come out, like it was-- like there was a fire going on-- or something like that.And, there-- those particular incidences weren't the same. I don't recall those.They didn't tell me about those until after the fact.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, starting in December timeframe, did you start to complain more about your confinement conditions?

Pfc. Manning

I did. In early December it was still informal.So, I was-- I was-- I started to voice my concerns with Master Sergeant Blenis.

I would-- I would be like, 'I don't understand where this discrepancy is,' and I voiced the concern to Captain Hocter as well, who would usually advise me, because he didn't feel like-- he didn't feel like the facility was going to listen his recommendations.At least, that is what he conveyed to me in these sessions.

He didn't feel like the facility trusted him.But-- So I complained more with-- with-- through Master Sergeant Blenis, and I don't recall if I ever brought it up with Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart.

But, I did ask about it at point in time in early December through then Master Sergeant Blenis.

Defense (Coombs)

[I believe I missed a question.]

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Master Sergeant Papakie.Whenever he did the rounds, he let me relax once, sir.That is the opportunity.When you are standing at parade rest, you are not really allowed to say anything.Whatever they tell you to relax, you can speak slightly a bit more freely.

So, I used that opportunity to raise my concern about it.I didn't put in-- what's called a-- they refer to it as a-- as a 'chit'.

It's a-- it's a Department of Defense Form 5-10, which is-- is a way that you convey communications apart from those through your counselor.

I filled out one of those forms.I gave it to the guard.I don't recall who it was.I think it was Corporal Miller.Again, I am guessing.

And, I gave him a- a chit, as they call it.And, a-- it was a general complaint about, you know, being on prevention of injury status.

I don't recall anything ever coming back on that.So, as I-- this, discussion with you-- and towards the end of December and early January I put in another one. This time to the facility commander-- and that staffing level as opposed to, you know, just a through the counselors.

So, I went up to the-- this one went through-- and I was worried that they might have lost the other one.So, I made a secondary copy.I wrote 'copy' and I wrote the exact same thing.I put 'copy' and I initialed it.It's in a box with Captain Tooman somewhere.I don't think that was part of anything-- to discovery or anything.

Defense (Coombs)

So, these 5-10's, what were you using these for?

Pfc. Manning

I put it in.So, that way I could convey to the commander the thought, and I looked into the rules and regulations of the facility about C&A [Classification and Assignment] board and everything else.

And, I-- I specifically requested for-- to have a C&A board, or for one to convene, or for-- or for me to be in one.I don't remember the exact wording of it.

But, I put it into-- I made sure that it went into the commander-- with two mailboxes on a cart.That were-- and I made sure that were brought in, and I physically put it in myself through the feed tray while Lance Corporal Miller-- not Lance Corporal Miller-- Lance Corporal Bell was the guard that brought it in.

And, that was the-- that was like early January.It was like the 5th of January or 6th or 7th.Somewhere around that timeframe.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Do you recall also filing with my assistance an RCM [Rules for Court Martial] 305(g) request to Col. Coffman [the Special Convening Authority] on 13 January [2011]?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. That was a week and a half after I put in that-- that commander request.I didn't receive anything back on it.

So, we went to the next administrative-- I mean, exhausting, in terms of exhausting administrative remedies.We went to the next one.And, that was-- that was the chain of-- that was the chain of command on the Army side.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what did you ask Colonel Coffman [Special Court Martial Convening Authority ] to do?

Pfc. Manning

I-- through counsel-- through you, sir, I asked him to review-- at least review my confinement conditions and see if they were necessary and if there-- there could override-- I don't recall the exact phrasing of the-- of the document, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, did you receive a response from Colonel Coffman?

Pfc. Manning

Through, again, you.You conveyed to me that there was a response.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what was the response?

Pfc. Manning

The response was that-- that it was either non-necessary or that a cursory look into it was appropriate and they found that this was proper.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall filing with my assistance an Article 138 complaint on 19 January 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I also recall that it was the same day as command visit in which I-- it might have been the same day that I had a command visit with Captain Casamatta, and raised up the issue of the fact that my 5-10's were not getting returned or answered to Captain Casamatta.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what issues were you concerned-- raising in your Article 138 complaint, in general?

Pfc. Manning

In general, just the confinement condition that I was under, and the fact that I felt that, you know, given what I was-- given the information that I had I felt that there was a discrepancy between the-- through you, you know the-- but in my opinion there was a discrepancy between the mental health professionals and Captain Hocter along with Colonel Malone-- [missed word] Colonel Malone and what they-- what they saw, as opposed to what the commander was doing, and I felt it was being done improperly.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, you indicated that you started to research and you made a 5-10 request to go to a C&A board?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, Sir.

Defense (Coombs)

When was the first time you went to a Classification & Assignment board?

Pfc. Manning

I don't remember the exact date, but it was a week or two after all this.

So, after the command visit.I remember there was a-- I was slated for a C&A board.It was an end of January 2011.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how did you find out about your ability to go to this board?

Pfc. Manning

It is in the rules and regulations for the facility.I knew that they-- I knew that-- I didn't-- I don't remember if-- if it is stated-- stated in the rules and regulations how often it occurred, but I felt like I-- I realized that I had the opportunity to ask for one if I felt it was necessary.

Defense (Coombs)

And, did you appear before the board?

Pfc. Manning

I did, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, who was at the board to the best of your recollection?

Pfc. Manning

Gunnery Sergeant-- then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis, Gunnery Sergeant Fuller, and another Staff Sergeant NCO.I don't recall exactly who it was.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you got in from to of the board, what happened?

Pfc. Manning

[Missed a few words]I was in full restraints.I was put into the conference room-- the same room where I would talk to the mental health counselors.

And, I sat down, and then they said that, 'The C&A board is convened, you have the floor, detainee Manning.'

Well, I reported in first.So, 'I-- I detainee Manning, my number.'My number at the time '10075 reporting, Gunnery Sergeant.'

Defense (Coombs)

And then once they said, 'You have the floor,' what happened?

Pfc. Manning

They sat me.Well, I sat down.I didn't-- I was like, 'Okay. I don't know how this works.'I mean I-- that was the first thing I said.'I don't know how this works'...in terms of the formality of the board.

They said, 'Just say what you feel about how you are confined-- confinement classification. You asked to meet here,' and then I ended up asking a lot of questions.

Defense (Coombs)

What questions were you asking?

Pfc. Manning

I realized that it was more of an adversarial thing.That they-- that they had-- that they had their conclusion among themselves in terms of the fact that I was staying on to POI status, and that it was my job to argue against that.

So, I ended up asking questions, because I didn't know-- I didn't-- I didn't know what I didn't know.So-- so I asked them, you know, what their feelings on the recommendations were, and how they were being met, and how processed worked to Gunnery Sergeant Fuller particularly.He was the most vocal out of the answering.

Defense (Coombs)

And, did they respond to your questions?

Pfc. Manning

They did. I asked about how the process worked from their vantage point.They explained to me about the recommendations-- that they make recommendations to the commander.

That those recommendations are based on information that they received through either the mental health professional, the-- the behavior reports, the watch's' logs, and all sorts of other stuff.

I don't recall the exact, you know, quotes or anything.Just a lot of the-- 'We use...' and I am quoting Gunnery Sergeant Fuller, 'We use a lot of different information points to put a picture together and recommend it to Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart, and he-- and we only make a recommendation.

'We don't-- and,' you know, 'everyone else only makes recommendations, but it is his final authority.'And, that was the way it was explained to me.

So, then I tried to swing them into recommending me to be off POI, but they, you know-- I wasn't prepared, because I didn't have any proof, and they wanted-- they wanted evidence.

They kept on saying that, 'We want evidence that you are not a harm to yourself, beyond' you know, 'you saying that you are not going to harm yourself.'

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. After this first board, do you-- Well, actually-- as part of this first board do you recall one of the board members asking you about your intake statement, 'Always planning, never acting'?

Pfc. Manning

There was a heavy focus on that, and I didn't realize-- I didn't-- I hadn't remembered that-- that statement was put down on there on that form.

I mean, I remember thinking-- cause I mean during the time whenever I went through it-- I mean, it was all fuzzy and I was-- and I had just arrived from Kuwait and everything else also, and I was filling out all this paperwork and everything else.

You know, I remember being told, you know-- you had to fill something out.And, I didn't-- and I explained that.I conveyed that-- that story to Gunnery Sergeant Fuller and so he's like, 'So you-- So you lied?!'

And I-- and I was like, 'I don't-- I don't know if it's a false statement.I don't know.I was told to put something down, and I put something down without really thinking about it.That felt-- it just--- I mean, I felt like whatever I-- whatever I put down there didn't matter anyway, cause I was going on suicide risk anyway, sir.'

Defense (Coombs)

And what--

Pfc. Manning

--and, I explained that to Gunnery Sergeant Fuller and-- and so he was-- it becomes-- it became an inquisition about whether I meant it-- whether I could be trusted with anything I said ever based upon that-- that confusion.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall as part of that kind of inquisition, Gunnery Sergeant Fuller saying, 'Well if we can't trust you are telling the truth at that time, you said something false, how can we trust that you are telling the truth now...'

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Defense (Coombs)

'...when you are saying that you are not going to harm yourself?'

Pfc. Manning

Correct. And, you know, I'm like, 'Well, I don't know.I don't know how you do that.I don't know how you leave that out.From my vantage point, you know I'm-- I'm the-- I'm the-- I'm the detainee. I mean there's not-- there is not a lot that I can do from my vantage point.'And, that I understood from that-- from that-- from that perspective.

You know, it was-- I just kept-- I mean, it just felt weird because it was-- it was-- it felt so long ago that that-- that that was.And, that was brought up.

And, that was so long ago.And, I was like, 'Well, what about now?'And then-- and then it went and it kept on coming back and forth to, 'Well if we can't trust you then, how can we trust you now?'

It was just very-- it was just a very unsettling and adversarial moment. I felt-- I felt like I was sort of put on the spot and being interrogated at that point.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, aside from this one time when the C&A board quizzed you about this statement, did-- did anyone else come up and talk to you about this statement?

Pfc. Manning

Before that?

Defense (Coombs)

Right.

Pfc. Manning

Not to my recollection.I don't recall that-- I don't recall Master Sergeant Blenis raising it as an issue.

I don't recall Chief Warrant Officer Averhart Four raising it as an issue.I didn't-- I spoke to him very-- at the point in time, I spoke to him very rarely.

And, Captain Hocter never said anything about it.So, those were the people-- those were the people that I talked to about these types of issues, and Colonel Malone, and they never really raised that.

That was the first time that, that-- that, that moment ever really popped up, and I remembered, 'Oh, yeah.I [missed word] that day.That did happen,' you know.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, how many times did you appear in front of the C&A board?

Pfc. Manning

There was-- they was another two times after that.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when generally from your memory, when was the second time?

Pfc. Manning

The second time was as soon as I got the results from the Article 138 complaint-- the justifications and I mean, basically, like-- sort of like a discovery packet.

It was attached to it with enclosures and things along with the actual response. Like the justifications of the response.And, I looked through it, and, you know, it just didn't, they would-- they would-- I felt like, you know, again, I am not an attorney.I felt like they just quote [missed word], like the raw data from-- there was a lot of these different reports from-- I remember there was-- I remember going through this list of different things, like, 'Oh, he's'...you know...'Oh he is doing well.' You know...'being respectful courteous.'There was just a list of different notes that Master Sergeant Blenis had made, and I just didn't-- I just didn't see anything adding up from my vantage point in there.

So, I-- So I went in with-- armed with those documents.They allowed me to bring those in.And, I felt like...I felt like, 'Oh, well now that I have--' you know, 'now that I have this evidence,' you know, 'I am going to be able to-- I am going to be able to persuade the C&A board.'I felt pretty confident about that.

Defense (Coombs)

So, how did you use this evidence, the next time you went in front of the C&A board?

Pfc. Manning

Well I came through-- I remember I started reading through it verbatim-- through them, you know-- through all the-- through all the points, including the-- including the ones-- ones that, you know-- that weren't necessarily, you know-- completely [missed word] all that way.

I don't recall exactly which ones they were or anything like that, but, you know, I read through them verbatim, and Gunnery Sergeant Fuller stopped me and, you know, asked me what I was doing, and I said, you know, 'I'm just-- I'm just reading through what I,' you know, 'with the things that,' you know-- and Gunnery Sergeant Blenis-- Master Sergeant Blenis was also on this board, so, you know, Master Sergeant Blenis or Gunnery Sergeant Blenis-- quote 'Gunnery Sergeant Blenis' unquote was saying in these-- in these reports or in these counseling notes and, you know, I was just trying to-- and I was just trying to convey to him that the-- I feel that those-- that, that could be justifications and such given that I didn't have the notes from Captain Hocter.

I said you know, 'I am pretty sure that Captain Hocter can back that up as well, and say that I am being respectful, and being courteous, and trying everything that I can to get off of this status.'I mean it is the only focus, at that-- at that time it was the only focus that I really had to [missed word]-- there was nothing going on with the case or anything.So, that was my focus was-- was just trying to improve my status.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you were using Gunnery Sergeant Blenis' own assessments of you--

Pfc. Manning

--Right.

Defense (Coombs)

--at the board did you get a sense that, that was persuasive at all to the members?

Pfc. Manning

Ah, no.

That was whenever I realized that the-- the-- that they weren't-- that they had already read these things.They already have these documents.

I wasn't sure if it was just Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart answering those, and the C&A board not being privy to them.

I mean I knew that the counseling notes that Gunnery Sergeant Blenis-- I didn't know what information they looked at a part from data points and all this other stuff.

I didn't know what specific documents they were looking at there, but I felt that these were-- they were convincing.

I felt like I could convince someone with them.But, they-- they had already seen them and, you know, it was just sort of-- then they returned back to the-- to-- I remember they raised that-- that question again at the intake-- the once-- the once, because I was asked three times.

You know, 'You were asked-- you were asked three times about whether you wanted to commit suicide.Two verbally and one written, and on the written one you wrote down, 'Always planning, always-- always--'

Defense (Coombs)

--'planning, never...'

Pfc. Manning

'Always planning, never acting,' you know, and-- and I remember being like, 'Well I said no.I am not suicidal.'And then they are like, 'Well, there is a discrepancy so that-- so we are not sure if we can trust you.'

Defense (Coombs)

Now, after this did you-- you said you went a third time, what was your experience like the third time you went in front of the board?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean I was-- I was-- I went in with the same sort of-- I don't recall-- I think it was a couple weeks after that, because I felt like I wanted to simmer-- let that simmer down because the-- because these boards were quite heated.

They got pretty heated on their end, and so I felt-- you know, I felt sort of taken aback.I mean I was more prepared the second time, but I still felt in the end I was getting-- I felt in the end it ended up being like an interrogation over the question-- over the question on the piece of paper and then, you know.

I kept on trying to drive it out of there, but it kept on coming back to that.So, I came to the third time, and, you know, I was like, you know, I don't really have-- I mean, I don't really have anything more other than I have another two weeks where I haven't had a disciplinary issue or anything.

I know that there was-- this was after the January [missed word] incident and you know-- I had Captain Hocter and Colonel Malone say that I was good to go on those. So, I didn't see-- I didn't see a continued issue of that on my end of course.And, I tried to convey that.

And, they didn't want to hear it.They told me that unless I had anything that-- that was new or that they hadn't heard before then, you know, then it was just a waste of time.

And, they didn't-- they didn't describe it as that, but-- but I mean that was the general feeling that I got back from them.

Defense (Coombs)

So, after that time period, did you ever request to appear before a board again?

Pfc. Manning

No. I did not, sir.At that point in time, I felt that like it was weighted against me.

I felt like they were merely looking for things to justify their decision that they had already made.So, they had already made the decision coming in.

Everybody-- and this is the way I felt-- was that they would come and have the board. They would meet, and then, they would look-- and then they would look for things that would justify their action, and ignore all the other things that I would talk about.

And, only focus on the things that-- that helped justify their position.So, I felt like having to go to these things was fruitless and pointless.

So, I went through the-- back to the legal channels and the Article 138 complaint and et cetera.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. Now, before we go into the next area I want to cover, I would like to go ahead and take a break.I've been told that we need at least fifteen minutes.So, your Honor--

Pfc. Manning

--about.

Defense (Coombs)

--can we have a fifteen minute break?

Judge Lind

Alright. Any objection from the Government?

Prosecution (Fein)

No, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Alright. Court is in recess until 10 minutes after 17 hundred, or five o'clock.

ALL RISE

ALL RISE

Judge Lind

Please be seated. This Article 39(a) Session is called to order.Let the record reflect all parties present when the Court last recessed are again present in Court.Mr. Coombs?

Defense (Coombs)

Thank you, your Honor.Pfc. Manning I remind you again you are under oath, okay?

Now I am gonna ask you a few questions about an incident on 18 January 2011.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Let's talk about how that day began.Did you notice any difference in the demeanor of the guards that day?

Pfc. Manning

From around-- yes, I did.From around the latter part of the morning, so from-- usually there is a lull in activity from zero seven to zero nine until like the duty hours come in. There's a lull in activity. By the time the activities are buzzing around at the facility, people started coming in-- guards that were just watching us-- or watching me.The vibe had changed among the guards that were there at the time.

Defense (Coombs)

How so?

Pfc. Manning

There demeanor was more-- just generally more anxious and more irritable.I don't know what-- I don't know what was going on or what was causing it, but and I didn't-- I mean I didn't-- I wasn't in a position to ask or anything, but I know-- I mean I definitely noticed a change in-- I mean sometimes whenever there's like an incident going on I usually know what-- usually infer or figure out what was going on, but I had no idea.

It's just-- everybody felt-- I mean and I assumed that it was something not to do with...I just assumed that morning-- if I remember that morning correctly I just remember-- I remember not know what it was that was causing this change, but there was definitely a strong significant difference in their...in their demeanor from zero nine to 11 was whenever I really started to notice the difference, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. Let's go to your rec hall. Did you notice a change when the guards came to get you for your recreation call?

Pfc. Manning

Ah, yes.

Defense (Coombs)

What time was this?

Pfc. Manning

I don't-- I don't remember what time this was.I think it was early afternoon.

Defense (Coombs)

And what did you notice different about the guards when they came to get you?

Pfc. Manning

They were a lot more-- they had a irritated voice through their Marine Corps demeanor. I could sense that there was some-- and I thought they were-- I thought they were angry at me.

I though there was sort of-- maybe it wasn't-- I mean, maybe it wasn't directed toward me, but there was like a general anger behind them that they were gonna take out on me.

Defense (Coombs)

Who are the guards?

Pfc. Manning

One of them that I remember was Lance Corporal Tankersly and I don't remember if he is Corporal or not, but I think he got promoted to Corporal eventually, but Corporal Cline.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you were taken out of your cell, what if anything happened that caused you to be concerned?

Pfc. Manning

Well, first they started-- they-- they-- they came in-- they came to my cell, and they were like, 'Do you want rec hall?' You know, I am like, 'Yeah.'And I stand at the front of the cell and say, 'Yes Lance Corporal.Yes, Corporal. I wish to proceed with my recreation call.'

And, it's like, you know-- you know, 'Stand by for...'-- you know, 'Stand by for recreation.' 'Stand by for your recreation call.'It was just a change in their voice.

And then this continued as they were putting restraints on me.They-- they put me on-- on-- I put myself on the rack, and they were like-- and then they said, 'Put your head against the rack...' or '...put your head against the wall.'

And, then they put the restraints on me, and they just-- It was just a general change in the demeanor.They put it tightened.They put their leg irons slightly tighter than normal.And, I asked them, you know, 'Are you...?' you know, I remember asking them if they were irritated or if I was doing something wrong or something like that-- to them, as they were putting me into the restraints, and--

Defense (Coombs)

Did--

Pfc. Manning

--they didn't respond to me.

Defense (Coombs)

Did the guards ever give you any inconsistent orders or correctors?

Pfc. Manning

No, not at this time.They were still giving consistent orders, but they-- they [missed a few words] tighter.

We then-- they transferred me to the recreation area.So, that's about a thirty meter walk to the recreation area. I am guessing the distance. It just felt-- it felt like thirty meters.

And, then we go to the recreation area.There is usually a chair where they set me down, so that they can put me on there. And they told me to face left, and I faced-- faced left.And, they told me-- I had another person tell me to face right.

There were another two-- if I remember-- it felt like there were like four guards there.As opposed to the normal-- as opposed to the normal number of two to three. It felt like there was four along with GM 2 [Gunner's Mate 2nd Class] Webb, who is the NCO.

Defense (Coombs)

Did they ever say and correct you for not saying their rank in response to a direct order?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, because I-- as I-- as I am speaking with one person I am saying, you know, 'Yes, Lance Corporal' or 'Aye, Lance Corporal,' you know, changing between-- because in the Marine Corps and in the Navy, 'Aye' is a response for whenever you're given a command, and you're-- you're told to execute, you say, 'Aye.'

You know, 'I am going to execute.''Aye, Lance Corporal.''Aye, Sir.'

And, then for receiving instruction-- not necessarily receiving an instruction, but for receiving to understand something you say, 'Yes.'

So as I am being told these different things, I am trying to respond to them, and I am being given all these conflicting things so I start to--So, I start to panic a little bit, because I don't know-- I don't know what's about to happen.

And I-- they've-- they've-- they've never really acted like-- I never had the guards act like that before, except for whenever I was put into the intake process they were-- for the-- I call it a 'shark attack' again, you know, basic training style-- you know, everything you do is wrong no matter what, because you have different people giving you conflicting orders, and you just execute as much as you can.

Defense (Coombs)

During this time do you recall becoming anxious and lightheaded?

Pfc. Manning

I did. I became anxious as they were taking off the restraints, and giving me the different instructions.I asked them if, you know-- I asked them to stop.

I didn't-- I mean, I might have-- I might have actually said, 'Please...'-- instead of, 'Please stop.'I might have said actually, 'Stop.'

But, you know I was-- I just wanted them to slow down a little bit, because and allow me to-- to catch my breath and understand, you know-- but they continued at it and then I-- as soon as they were removed me from final restraints and then they give me more turn orders, I, you know, I began to fall.

And, I remember GM 2 Webb in particular came at me, as I was about to fall and I thought-- and you know, I am not-- this was just my panic reaction.I thought maybe that with the irritation and everything and the fact that-- I thought I was going to be attacked or assaulted or something like that.

I mean as silly as it sounds, and in retrospect, but, you know, they didn't do anything.I thought he was just coming at me.He was just coming to-- to make sure I didn't fall, but my instant reaction was to get away from GM 2 Webb, who is a bigger guy.

So, I wanted to get away from this large person coming at me at a high rate of speed. And, I am not feeling very-- my judgment was not perfect at that time.

So, you know, I just got away and I got emotional, and I didn't-- I didn't want-- I didn't want them to come, you know, rush me out with riot gear and stuff, so I-- I said, 'Please stop,' you know, 'I am not doing anything.

I am trying to cooperate as much as I can,' and I think I-- I think at that point I stopped and I got a little bit emotional, but they said, 'We're gonna get somebody here to talk to you.'I think-- 'We're gonna get somebody here,' I remember GM 2 Webb trying to calm me down, and get this situation under control.

Defense (Coombs)

And so, once-- once GM 2 Webb was calming you down--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--what happened next?

Pfc. Manning

A number of-- of enlisted-- a large number of enlisted personnel from the facility entered in. I don't recall exactly who.

And, then Gunnery Sergeant Fuller, the Security NCOI-- NCO of the facility.I don't recall his exact-- the exact title. But, he usually dealt with security and operations.

He came and talked to me, and got up-- and I explained to him what had happened and what was going on.And, then he-- and then he said, you know 'We are gonna take care of it, and we are going to take care of you.Is there anything else you need?Do you need to talk to anybody?Do you need to talk to one of the...one of the [MD?]'Their term 'docs' again.'Would you like to speak with anybody?'

I said, 'No, I just-- I just,' you know, 'I just wanted-- I just wanted them,' and I explained that, you know, 'I felt like they were being rough with me.' Maybe not intentionally or not, but, you know, I just felt like I was being roughed around a little bit in terms of the 'shark attack' [missed a few words], sir.

I wanted to continue on with my rec as normal, and they allowed me to do that, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you continued on with your rec as normal did you have any other issues during rec hall?

Pfc. Manning

I did not, sir.I thought-- I thought everything had been dealt with at that point.

Defense (Coombs)

And then, after rec hall where did you go?

Pfc. Manning

They took me back.It was different-- there were two different guards I remember.GM 2 Webb was still the--- the DBS [Duty Brig Supervisor] at the time, but they transferred me back to my cell, and I returned back to my cell.

Defense (Coombs)

So, when you say two different guards, they replaced Lance Corporal Tankersly and Cline?

Pfc. Manning

I don't know if-- they change guards out pretty frequently, so don't know-- I mean sometimes they don't, sometimes they do, you know, I am not privy to that.

So, I don't know who, did what or why.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So when you got back to your cell, what did you do?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I went back to sitting in my usual spot.

Defense (Coombs)

And, then what happened?

Pfc. Manning

There was a lot more activity going around.In terms of NCO's walking by, going to the observation booth and things.

I mean I didn't think to much of it, apart from, you know, that there was a buzz of activity-- of increased activity.There were guards started to trickle into the special quarters area and-- and it was really quiet, but there was a lot of whispering and low voices and things-- a lot of weird things happening.

But, a lot of weird things happened all the time here [laughs], so I didn't think to much of it.

Defense (Coombs)

Did Chief CW4 Averhart ever come to your cell?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I don't recall how long afterwards-- after that it was.It was at least 45 minutes, if not, a couple of hours.

Again, it's been a long time since this happened.There was an increase in the buzz at-- in the special quarters area.And, then Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart came to speak with me directly outside my cell.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what did he say to you?

Pfc. Manning

He stopped and stood right outside my cell.And, I stood.I mean, of course, the whole housing unit is at attention for him.

And, then they didn't-- they didn't-- I don't remember if they said, 'Carry on,' or not but then he told me to, you know, he didn't tell me to relax or anything.

So I am standing at attention as he's saying, you know, 'We just had-- we just had an incident,' you know, 'Why'd you...'-- and I remember him saying something to the effect of-- of, you know, 'Why are you violating my trust?I've allowed you to-- I 've allowed you to have this recreation call, so why are you causing trouble,' and everything else.

I didn't get a chance to explain-- until after I had been sort of-- I don't want to use the term-- the best term I could think of right now off the top of my head is 'lecture'.

I don't mean that in a demeaning way or anything to a field grade Warrant Officer. But, you know, that's how I felt at the time.

Defense (Coombs)

So, he was asking you questions about what happened?

Pfc. Manning

No. No. No. He was saying-- he wasn't asking-- he didn't ask questions until later.

He said, 'Why are you violating my trust with your activities and your...? I've allowed you,'and I specifically remember him saying, 'I've allowed you to have this recreation time.I've change the special handling instructions.'

And, he told me that if-- and he went back to, if he told-- told-- as he told me before, you know, he's allowing me to-- this-- this exception-- the policy essentially and if I violated that trust, then he would put me back on, you know, put me back to having regular rec call.

And, I was afraid that he was going to take that away at that point.And, then he started asking me questions as-- assuming I was given the opportunity to-- I think Master Sergeant Papakie came-- passed by.I don't remember of that was the case or not.But, I was told to relax at some point and then he started asking me questions.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what questions was Chief Averhart asking you?

Pfc. Manning

You know, he came back to, 'Why are you' you know, 'my trust, as' you know, 'your a detainee, and you are a high visibility--'

He didn't say 'high visibility' but essentially 'a detainee at this facility that's' you know-- you know, 'Why-- why are you a detainee that wants to cause trouble?' essentially.

'Sir, I don't know.I don't want to cause-- I don't want to cause trouble.I don't want to cause-- I am trying not to cause any situations or incidents or anything like that.'I-- I apologized for any confusion and et cetera.

Defense (Coombs)

Did there come a time when you asked him why you were still on POI?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. This was maybe at least five minutes into this-- into this conversation, and it turned into a conversations.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how did he respond to you?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I started, you know, being told to relax and not be at attention, I felt more compelled to be able to speak my mind a little bit, and I felt like this was an opportunity since I had the senior staff there, you know just to-- just to make one more-- to make one-- have one more change to argue and to try to keep them from effectively putting me on, you know-- to take my recreation call away, which was my concern at that time.

And, and, he was not happy about the fact that I started to-- to ask questions and state, you know, that I felt that-- that, you know-- you know, I felt that I was trying so hard and why couldn't I just get a little bit more.

Defense (Coombs)

And, how did he respond to your questions about POI?

Pfc. Manning

He-- he gave me the-- he gave me the answer that, you know, 'It's my decision. This is my facility.I am the Brig Commander,' you know, ' I am the Brig OIC [Officer in Charge].I am the Brig Commander,' you know, they don't really use the term 'Commander' by itself, but 'I am the Brig OIC,' and 'I make the decisions, and you,' and he said quite a number of times, you know, 'I feel like you violated my trust,' you know, 'in allowing you to have this privilege.'

And, I countered that with, you know, I felt that I should not be on POI.And, you know, I have put in these complaints and things, and the, you know, the 138 complaint had been put in at this time, you know, I started to talk about that.

And, he felt that I-- from what I gauge-- I mean, I think he felt insulted by the fact that a detainee in a cell was, you know, saying these things, sir. Sorry that happened.

Defense (Coombs)

And, so when you started pushing back, what did Chief Averhart do?

Pfc. Manning

What is that?

Defense (Coombs)

When you started pushing back on, 'Hey I don't feel I need to be in POI.I don't understand why I am in POI,' what did Chief Averhart do in response?

Pfc. Manning

Chief Warrant Officer-- Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart he got angry.

I mean, he was furious.I've-- I've only seen a field grade-- I've only seen a field grade officer angry twice in my life at this level.Once in-- at Fort Drum, whenever he-- somebody found out that-- about something really terrible, and this was the only other time.

And, I've-- you know it was just-- I was just blown away.I mean, I was scared at this point.He was yelling.I mean, I felt like he was yelling at me at this point.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you ask him to stop yelling at you?

Pfc. Manning

I did.

Defense (Coombs)

And what did he say in response?

Pfc. Manning

I went back to attention and just listened. And, then he left and said-- he yelled-- and I remember Master Sergeant Papakie was-- was there at this time.

I am standing at attention, and he said to the guards who were standing outside the booth, and they had sort of their jaw-- a jaw drop look on them-- he said-- he turned to them and said, 'Special move. SR [Suicide Risk]'

And, I-- I lost my demeanor at that point, and then I humbled-- I mean I was like-- I can't believe, you know-- you know, I am trying to keep from losing my recreation call, and I am being put on-- I am going back to square one since I got here.

And, I almost-- I almost punch the wall.I mean I was so pissed, anxious, furious, just a lot different-- just shock, you know.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you striking yourself in the head during this time?

Pfc. Manning

No. I grabbed-- I grabbed at my head. I mean, just-- I was-- I mean, just-- I don't know how else to describe-- you know, the way I was feeling apart from, you know just, I didn't know-- I didn't know what to do at this-- I was helpless at that point.

Defense (Coombs)

So, when you said that you grabbed at your head, you put your-- your hands up to both side of your head, just above your ears, is that what you did?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. If I'm-- you know, I lost my-- I was-- I was standing at attention one second, and now I'm not.

I'm standing just losing my-- I lost my demeanor at that point.I-- I don't know if I yelled at that point.I think I did.I was just like, 'Oh, God,' or something like-- like that. Some-- some--

Defense (Coombs)

Now, how soon after this incident did you start having a conversation with Master Sergeant Papakie about what just occurred.

Pfc. Manning

Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart stormed off after he said, 'SR' or 'Special Move SR' to the guards and stormed out.

And, Master Sergeant Papakie was still there, and then Gunnery Sergeant...I don't remember the exact order of the conversations, but Gunnery Sergeant Blenis eventually came in and talk to me.

Defense (Coombs)

And, at that moment did you know--

Pfc. Manning

--then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. At that moment did you know that they were video taping you?

Pfc. Manning

I saw the video camera at some point.I did not think that they were recording the entire conversation.

I thought that they-- I saw-- I saw at some point, I don't remember where, I was like, 'Is that a video camera?' Because I hadn't seen a video camera in a very long time.So, it struck me as something odd.

I didn't even know that they had such a thing, as a hand held camera .Because there were cameras in the ceilings everywhere-- you know, in the facility, but this was the first time I had seen a digital camcorder.I thought they were [missed a word] going to happen, but I didn't think they were recording me at the time.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so.The-- the time period when Chief Averhart leaves to the time period that Master Sergeant Papakie now is there talking to you in your cell.How much time would you estimate has transpired?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall.I really don't.Minutes.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So, what we're going to do, is we are going to go ahead and to take a look at the two videos from that time period, and I am going to ask you a few questions about that.

Pfc. Manning

Alright. I've-- I've got the screen there, so.

[A video of Pfc. Manning standing behind the cross thatched bars of his Quantico cell, being forced to hand over his clothes is having the following exchange with two senior staff members and guards at the Quantico Brig on 18 January 2011.

A9X7ccZCAAAJzks Image source: Clark Stoeckley

In the video are Pfc. Manning, Master Sergeant Papakie, Gunnery Sergeant Blenis, and Gunners Mate 2nd Class Webb.

Because of technical problems, only audio was available to the press pool.The video, however, was viewable in the courtroom.

A transcript of the video was available in the defense Article 13 motion. I have left some speakers that I could not name labeled as they are in the Article 13 motion, vis. 'redacted' or 'XXXXXXXXXX'.]

Master Sergeant Papakie

I know what you're getting at, ok? I'm telling you that we're not outside the rules and regulations of anything that we're doing. Period. We're not. So I need your clothes.

Pfc. Manning

That's fine, sir. [Manning strips to his underwear. The rest of the conversation takes place with PFC Manning in his underwear].

XXXXXXXXXX

Skivvies say on?

Other Guard

yes. ... leave those on.

XXXXXXXXXX

We're going to get someone over here to talk to you. ... You have one mattress, right? You have the one suicide blanket, right?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Yes, sir.

XXXXXXXXXX

Shower shoes are fine. Let's get the doc over here. XXXXXXXXXX Sit down and see what's going on. Alright? I need you calm right now, alright? The escalation in your demeanor, alright, weighs us on the side of caution. Do you understand that?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, MSGT.

Defense (Coombs)

Just for a moment. This person here that is closest to the camera, who is this?

Pfc. Manning

That is Master Sergeant Papakie.

Defense (Coombs)

And the person that is now facing you, that is just in front of him, who is that?

Pfc. Manning

That is then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis-- Master Sergeant Blenis.

Defense (Coombs)

And the taller gentleman who is standing behind him, who is that?

Pfc. Manning

That is GM 2 Webb, Gunners Mate 2.It's an E5 position.

[Video resumes.]

Master Sergeant Papakie

The best way to explain that to you is you had an outburst. You were moving around. You almost punched a wall. You're kind of throwing yourself around in the cell. To make sure you don't hurt yourself we're putting you on a suicide risk status. We're upgrading your status.

Pfc. Manning

But I'm not a suicide risk.

Master Sergeant Papakie

That's not for me to decide. I have to make sure, the brig officer has to make sure, that you're taken care of.

Pfc. Manning

I understand MSGT.

Master Sergeant Papakie

In the manner that you're not going to hurt yourself. Right now, I don't know that. With the display I saw right now, I'm not comfortable with. He's not comfortable with. Until we get something otherwise, this is how it's going to be.

Pfc. Manning

Why was I on, why was I on prevention of status for almost 6 months?

Master Sergeant Papakie

[chuckles to himself] I know this is no secret to you ... I have plenty of documentation. Plenty of documentation based on things that you've said, things that you've done. Actions – I have to make sure, we have to make sure, that you're taken care of.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, MSGT.

Master Sergeant Papakie

Things that you've said and things that you've done don't steer us on the side of "ok, well, he can just be a normal detainee." They make us stay on the side of caution.

Pfc. Manning

But what about recommendations by the psychiatrist to remove me off the status?

Master Sergeant Papakie

Who's here every day? Who's here every day? We are. Who sees you every day? That's all he is, is a recommendation. We have, by law, rules and regulations set forth to make sure from a jail standpoint that Manning does not hurt himself. Maybe from a psychiatric standpoint, the recommendation he's given, I get it, I got it, understand, OK? But he's not the only decision maker. A mental health specialist is not the only decision that gets made.

Pfc. Manning

I understand that, sir.

XXXXXXXXXX

However...

Defense (Coombs)

The windows down here, is that-- are those the windows that you get natural light from?

Pfc. Manning

If you put-- if you place your head up against the thatched portion where the door is--

Defense (Coombs)

Mm-hmm.

Pfc. Manning

--and you poke your eye through barely you can see the reflections, but you can't actually see the window.You can't see the window itself from inside the cell.

Defense (Coombs)

And are these the bars that they said you were licking, or appeared to be licking, when you were sleep walking?

Pfc. Manning

I assume so, Sir.

[Video resumes.]

[XXXXXXXXXX leaves and XXXXXXXXXX enters]

[inaudible]

Pfc. Manning

I got dizzy ...

XXXXXXXXXX

Wasn't dehydration?

Pfc. Manning

No, I was anxious because I didn't know why the guards were so edgy. ... They raised their voice ... And I didn't ... I was getting anxious because they were getting anxious. So I was trying to figure out what was the cause of them getting anxious. It seemed to me that they were looking for something wrong...

XXXXXXXXXX

Something wrong as in a rules violation, or something wrong as in ...

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

XXXXXXXXXX

Rules violation?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Because I've been here for a long time, so everything becomes automatic. So I don't know if I say something and they respond. I don't know what happened. I've been in, inside so long – I don't remember the last time I was outside.

...

[Portions of the rest of the dialogue between XXXXXXXXXX and PFC Manning are inaudible]

XXXXXXXXXX

So, let's go back to when you fell down. Did you fall down or did you sit down? Or...

Defense (Coombs)

Now the camera goes inside of a room.What's the room that the camera goes inside of?

Pfc. Manning

That is the observation booth, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what we see here.I will let it go forward a little bit in a second, but is this figure here you?

Pfc. Manning

That is me.That is cell 192, and the one to right that has all of my belongings in a box there is cell 191.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So, this would be the view that the guards would be able to have of you from inside the cell-- or excuse me, the observation room, correct?

Pfc. Manning

Ah, yes. Correct, Sir.

[Video resumes.]

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so let's go to the second video.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Now due to where the camera is at the audio here is really not so good.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir.

Defense (Coombs)

This conversation that you are having with Gunnery Sergeant Blenis from your memory, what are you talking about?

Pfc. Manning

I am just trying to talk to him about, you know-- trying to show him-- I just remember, I wanted to convey to him that, you know-- I am not trying to be a problem.

And, you know, I am trying to talk to him about POI status and everything else.

Just-- just the usual-- I mean, this-- this-- apart from the fact that we have the bars in between us, sometimes we would talk like this in the office.

This is much like the conversations that we would normally have.Except obviously I was in boxers and [missed last word].

Defense (Coombs)

And, so at this point all you have on is just your boxers?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir. That is correct.

Defense (Coombs)

And, Ma'am.The defense motion does its best to give an audio version of this.I don't believe this is very long, but I do believe that the audio get a little better. If it doesn't, I don't believe it is necessary for you to see all of it.

[A second video plays.Because of technical problems, only audio was available to the press pool.The video, however, was viewable in the Courtroom.

A transcript of the video was available in the defense Article 13 motion. I have left some speakers that I could not name labeled as they are in the Article 13 motion, as redacted or XXXXXXXXXX.]

Pfc. Manning

Ah, it was mixed. I mean, I was getting lightheaded because I was hyperventilating. So, I was trying to stand up. I was trying to keep from falling because I was worried that if I fell, then everybody would panic and that would make matters worse. So, I tried to stand up and I ended up falling...

...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Take me from end of rec hall to ... where we are now ...

Pfc. Manning

Ok, yes, I started, I got in here and it was normal. And then I started reading my book. And then, I want to say it was MSGT [inaudible] that was the first to show up. And then he came in and was asking me all these questions. I was, ah, trying to figure out how to word the answers without causing any more anxiety. I was trying to figure out ways of not sounding, or not being construed as ... ways that things weren't going to be construed so that ... just trying to figure out ways in which I could tactfully say what I was trying to say without violating any rules and regulation or raise any concern about ...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Concern's already raised... [inaudible]

Pfc. Manning

Yes, but I'm trying not, I'm trying, I'm trying to avoid the concern, and it's actually causing the concern. I mean, cause, I'm getting ... every day that passes by, I'm getting increasingly frustrated, I'm not going to lie. Because I'm trying to do everything that I can not to be a concern, therefore I appear as though I am causing more concern. Or I ... Or it seems that I'm causing more concern or everybody's looking for something to cause concern. So that's what frustrates me. ... Trying to work out the most politically correct way of ...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

[largely inaudible] Let's go back to today. ... The anxiety here, today. That's not the first time it's happened since you've been in confinement. As far as I know, it is the first time it's happened since you've been here ... but a similar situation ...

Pfc. Manning

I wasn't, in Kuwait, I had no idea what was going on generally.

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

But, would you say it was similar situation?

Pfc. Manning

No, no. The situation that happened today was more of ... you know, I'm lucid and aware and just trying to figure ... It's just a question of trying not to appear like I was in Kuwait. Because that's my main concern every day, is how do I get off of POI status? How do I get off of POI status? When will I be taken off of POI status? What is being used to justify the precautions? You know ... What concerns, you know, what am I doing that's concerning [inaudible]? So I'm constantly trying to figure out, run through all of those things. And trying to make sure I'm not doing anything...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

[inaudible] ... As time goes on, we have less of a concern, ok?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, GYSGT. But the restrictions were still in place. And I was ...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Right. And we continually... We understand it's not normal that we have someone in POI for this period of time...

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

It's not [normal] ... I guess we'll just leave it at that. So as we go on, we're going to lessen your restrictions. They're still be restrictions in place ... [inaudible] But I would have to disagree with you as far as what happened today happened in Kuwait ... anxiety attack ...

Pfc. Manning

No, in Kuwait, I wasn't lucid. I had... [guard interrupts]. It was like a dream...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

But, they both ultimately ended up in you having an anxiety attack ... controlled fall, but ...

Pfc. Manning

No, I don't remember falling in Kuwait at all.

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Well, I can tell you, that's what was reported to us ... none of us were there [refers again to PFC Manning's suicide status Kuwait] ... Us, as a facility, we have to always err on the side of caution, okay. And not just the side of caution, but over-caution. Especially when we're talking about suicide, okay? Nobody's saying you're going to kill yourself, alright? [inaudible] But we always have to be more cautious than that. But you're saying that 'nobody else is on suicide watch.' The thing is what happened in Kuwait, what happened today ...

Pfc. Manning

Those are totally different. I understand, I understand, I understand, where you're getting that ... from the documentation. I mean, I quite, I know where I am. I know I am ... I know I am at Quantico base facility. I know that I'm at a brig. I mean, I'm lucid and aware of where I am. I'm not ...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

You asked [MSGT] a question ... about why you're on suicide watch, I'm trying to answer that question, okay? Did I answer that?

Pfc. Manning

Uh – no. No, with context. Because the fact that ...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

[inaudible] Did you understand that?

Pfc. Manning

I would have understood had ... had I not been ... I would have understood had ... had I not been ... I mean, I'm trying to think of how to word this proper ...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Provoked? Provoked?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, a little. I feel like the facility, honestly, I feel like the facility is looking for reasons to keep me on POI status.

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Inaudible. I can tell you 'no'...

Pfc. Manning

I mean, at least not at the staff level, I'm thinking the CO [Commanding Officer] – me, myself, personally.

Master Sergeant Papakie

Inaudible ... From a logistical standpoint, it's a burden on us. ...

Pfc. Manning

Yes, MSGT.

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Nobody finds that as a joy. It's not a punitive thing, I understand why someone would see it as a punitive thing because restrictions placed [inaudible] ... I can tell you that ... since you have been here ... I wish I had a hundred Mannings ...

Defense (Coombs)

Did you hear there-- where he told you-- Gunnery Sergeant Blenis said as far as your conduct, 'I wish I had a hundred Mannings'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I did.I heard very often from then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis.

[Video resumes.]

Pfc. Manning

And that's what... And that's where I don't understand why the continuation of the policy and restrictions beyond the time recommended by you and the psychiatrist. I mean the psychiatrist, is saying. I mean, I've got my own forensic psychiatrist that's saying now that the POI status is actually doing psychiatric harm and not, you know, and it's actually, you know, increasing my chances, rather than decreasing...

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Did you feel like that two weeks ago?

Pfc. Manning

What's that?

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Did you feel like that two weeks ago?

Pfc. Manning

Yes GYSGT.

Gunnery Sergeant Blenis

Uh, two weeks ago, I asked you, like, how you were feeling and you said you were fine, do you remember that?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, and I still feel fine. I mean, I feel, I feel fine, but at the same time, I've been putting in, I've been putting in...

[Second video ends.]

Judge Lind

Is there any copy of this that has a better audio?A clearer audio? [Missed a few words.]

Defense (Coombs)

Your honor, [missed a sentence]. [Missed] tried to provide a transcript. [Missed a few words] can't find it.But, this is the best copy that we have been provided.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am.If it is listened to on an individual computer, it substantially clearer than over loud speakers.

Judge Lind

Alright. Thank you.

Defense (Coombs)

[to Judge Lind]

It is-- I believe attachment 25 of the defense's motion.

[to Pfc. Manning]

So, Pfc. Manning, looking at that video, what thoughts come back to your mind today?

Pfc. Manning

I mean-- I haven't seen that video in several months.So, you know-- it just brings that back, you know, the fact that I was there and everything else.

Just a-- it's weird seeing-- it's also weird seeing myself from the third person.

Defense (Coombs)

I understand.So, on that day what were you doing the rest of the day, once you were put on suicide risk?

Pfc. Manning

I sat-- out-- I had been spoken to following this by Captain Hocter and Captain Moore was also there.

And they sat down, and I talk to them.

And, and then I spent most of the day just sitting there with-- I believe there was a PFC that was assigned into-- I think it was PFC [Randy Wa?] was-- sat down right outside the cell and watched me on suicide risk.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, in the video you had your glasses.Did they ever remove the glasses from you?

Pfc. Manning

Later that day they removed the glasses.I think I got them back at some point.I don't know if it was the same day, or if it was a few days later.

I don't recall.But, I do know that for a brief period of time I had them removed [missed two words].

And, a night had them removed-- at night, or after-- after taps.

Defense (Coombs)

And, if you are stripped down to your underwear at that point, is there a time that they give you additional clothing during the day?

Pfc. Manning

Not on suicide risk, which they put me on after that. Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart put me on Suicide Risk.

Defense (Coombs)

So, for the rest of the day, you were just in your boxers?

Pfc. Manning

For the rest of my day I would-- well, I had the blanket.

I had the POI blanket.So, I just sat there on the-- on the mattress.I had the blue mattress at that point, and I just sat there with a POI blanket just wrapped over me.

Defense (Coombs)

How many days, from your memory, were you on Suicide Risk, before you were put back on POI?

Pfc. Manning

It was less than a week if I recall correctly.

I mean there was-- there was a-- there was a period of time when-- cause I remember Captain Hocter came and he said that he was going to put me on-- that he was going to recommend that I be put on POI, but not suicide risk.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, the following day that you were still on suicide risk, were you just in your boxers or did they give you additional clothing on that day-- to the best of your memory?

Pfc. Manning

They might have given me a T-Shirt.I don't recall exactly.Yeah, I probably should say, because I don't remember.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. So, let's go back to your Article 138 complaint--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--for a moment.When did you receive the response-- to the best of your memory-- to your Article 138 complaint?

Pfc. Manning

The response to the Article 138 complaint was on-- it was February-- I don't think it was-- I don't think it was like January.That was January?I don't recall the time.I just remember there being a first.

Defense (Coombs)

Would 1 March [2011] sound about right to you?

Pfc. Manning

Yeah. It was the next month after that. So, yes.1-- Not 1 March-- I mean, late February is what I remember. That's what it feels like.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. So, the-- after you receive--

Pfc. Manning

I-- I feel like I got it before I was suppose to get it, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. After you received the Article 138 response, you also recall roughly around that time receiving notification of additional charges being referred against you.

Pfc. Manning

I had heard through you that they were coming a few weeks prior to that.

We didn't-- if I remember-- I mean, again this is two years ago, February.

But I recall, that we knew that charges were coming, we just didn't know-- we didn't know the exact specifications or anything, but we knew the general nature from trial counsel, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Now when you had filed your 138 response did you have any hope that, that may bear fruit, and result in your being taken off of MAX and POI?

Pfc. Manning

Not really.I had-- I mean I didn't know what to-- I didn't know-- I didn't really, you know-- the saying in the military is you know, 'You hope-- you hope for the-- the best, but prepare for the worst' and I was prepared for the worst at that point.

Defense (Coombs)

Was being on MAX and POI for the length of time that you were frustrating to you?

Pfc. Manning

It was frustrating, and I began to get more frustrated as it went on until it just didn't-- it just didn't matter.

There was a certain point, I don't recall when-- I mean, it might have been February or-- or-- no, it was March-- it was more towards that after the change over-- the change in command, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. And do you recall on 2 March having the opportunity to speak to Master Sergeant Papakie, the gentleman that we saw first in the video about POI again?

Pfc. Manning

On 2 March?

Defense (Coombs)

Yes.

Pfc. Manning

Okay, so that-- yes.A months an a half later.Oh this is the-- on that day Master Sergeant Papakie came by and did a check, but it-- what was unusual about this check was that he stopped by the cell and he told me to relax.

Because, normally whenever the senior staff of the facility passed through you were standing at parade rest.I was standing at parade rest or at attention any [missed word] there was an officer or senior enlisted person.

And it was generally accepted, I mean it was generally known you weren't suppose to respond except for, you know 'Yes.''Yes, Master Sergeant.''Yes, sir,' for pretty much anything, until you had been put into-- unless you were told to relax, and you were given sort of a little bit of freedom to speak.

And, he had-- he had given me the opportunity, so I decided that it's been-- it's been a little bit of time since the last time I raised this with Master Sergeant Papakie, and he seemed like-- he seemed to be in a good mood, so I started to talk to him.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what did you ask him?

Pfc. Manning

I asked him more about the comfort level of the facility as he kept on discussing.

As we discussed previously, his comfort level with particularly the commander's comfort level of, you know, me being-- you know, put onto restrictions or precautions, and-- and I remember the change over had already occurred-- this was after the change over-- and had been just enough time to where I thought after, you know, after Chief Warrant Officer Two Barnes had been put in as the new commander, I thought maybe I could given the opportunity now, I could get a chance to grab the ear of Master Sergeant Papakie, and in this moment to-- you know, talk to him about how I felt about it.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you hopeful that when you talked to him that maybe with a change of leadership, the new commander, that, that would result in you being taken off MAX and POI?

Pfc. Manning

I thought at last maybe I had the-- the opportunity to have somebody different because I-- I had felt that after the-- after the 'Special Move to SR'that I was never going to be able to convince Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart of anything, so I-- but I felt that maybe that would be different with Chief Warrant Officer Two Barnes.

Defense (Coombs)

And when you were speaking with Master Sergeant Papakie, what did he say back to you regarding your requests on POI?

Pfc. Manning

Very similar things to what he had stated in the video we had just seen.But, he was a lot more relaxed and there wasn't as much tension, sir.

It's one of the few times I was given an opportunity to speak at level with him. So, I don't have to stand at parade rest.I can sort of, you know, be myself, and maybe speak my mind, and maybe talk to him a little but about different things.

Defense (Coombs)

What do you recall him saying to him about POI?

Pfc. Manning

Particularly with prevention of injury, it went back to-- you know, 'We have concerns,' you know, 'about what happened in Kuwait,' you know, 'We are not trusting you,' you know, 'We're not...you're doing,' you know, 'You're doing what you're suppose to but then,' you know, 'there are things that we're concerned about.'

And-- and, you know I-- and, as you know-- and, I just-- I tried to plead with him just a little bit about, you know, making small changes to the POI, you know-- just maybe chop at-- chop away at it between the different-- maybe they would have sort of a-- if I couldn't get prevention of injury, you know, removed, maybe I could chip away at different things, and have a gradual change over the-- over a period of weeks or months.

And, he said that he might convey that toChief Warrant Officer Barnes.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you ever convey to him any comments about your underwear?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. There was a moment in there where, you know-- I just wanted to convey the fact that, you know, I've been-- again I kept on telling him I've been on the status for a long time, you know-- and I am not doing anything to harm myself.

I mean, I have, you know-- and it came back to, you know, 'I've been in here and yet,' you know, 'I'm not throwing myself against the walls or' your know, 'jumping up and down,' you know, 'trying to [missed word] into the toilet and drown...'you know just all sorts of different examples of how-- you know, if I-- if I was really a danger-- if I-- if I, you know-- you know, just venting a little bit about, you know-- about how if I was a danger to myself, you know I would-- I would, I am sure I would generally act out more.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you ever tell him--

Pfc. Manning

--and I used the underwear as an example, you know-- I said to him, you know, 'If I really wanted-- if I really wanted to hurt myself, I mean wouldn't I just use the things that are here now,' you know, 'the underwear, the flip flops. These are all-- these are all things that could,' you know, 'they could-- they could potentially be used,' you know-- you know, 'as something to harm oneself of others,' you know.

'And, when does it stop?Does it stop with removing walls?Does it stop with the padding,' you know, 'everything?Does it stop with a straight jacket?'And just-- I venteda little bit, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

How did Master Sergeant Papakie respond to you when you pointed out the fact that you could harm yourself with your underwear or your flip flops if you wanted?

Pfc. Manning

He was nodding through that and he continued on the conversation and, you know-- I don't recall when it switched over to-- I mean there was no-- there was no immediate change in the conversation.

I mean I just-- I actually thought that maybe my point had gotten across, cause he was nodding, you know-- not quite smiling from-- he wasn't a person-- a person to really smile much, but I felt like he was listening and understanding-- I mean nodding, and we continued our conversation.

Defense (Coombs)

At any point until the conversation ended, did you see from him demeanor any sort of alarm or concern, based upon what you were saying?

Pfc. Manning

No, I actually thought-- I actually thought the opposite was occurring.I thought-- I thought-- I thought I was actually getting through to Master Sergeant Papakie, so I continued.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, after this conversation completed, did anything about your handling instructions change?

Pfc. Manning

Not immediately.It was a couple hours later that they came with different handling instructions for night.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what was different about the handling instructions at night?

Pfc. Manning

They removed-- they removed my underwear, and they tookmy flip flops out of my cell for the two things that I-- that I had been-- mentioned in particular.

Defense (Coombs)

And, so when they removed your underwear at night, I imagine this was the night of the 2nd of March when you made the comment?

Pfc. Manning

The comment was made near the afternoon.

Defense (Coombs)

No, I mean the 2nd of March is when they removed the underwear from you at that point that night?

Pfc. Manning

Well they-- yes, they-- they-- they executed the special handling instruction.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what were you sleeping in then, on that night?

Pfc. Manning

I slept with my POI blankets, my prevention of injury blankets and mattress.

They took my glasses away.They took my flip flops away.They took my underwear away.They took my T-Shirt away.My sock.All of most of it.

Defense (Coombs)

Did anyone explain to you why there was a change in your handling instructions?

Pfc. Manning

I've, you know-- I've since-- I mean, you know, because of the specific-- the specificity of those two things I sensed that-- that-- I sensed what had happened.

Defense (Coombs)

But, no one actually told you?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall.I don't recall who came by.I think it might have been Master Sergeant Blenis, then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis that kind of came by and explained to me the-- maybe it was Chief Warrant Officer Two Barnes, herself, that came by and actually told me that the-- special handling instructions.Somebody-- somebody came by and explained it to me, Sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so the next morning at the morning reveille, the morning call, what happened on that morning?

Pfc. Manning

The morning of March 3rd was the first day that I had the special handling instructions changed.

So, they called-- they announced, 'Reveille Reveille Reveille' as they do every morning at zero five.

And-- and-- I stood and I grabbed-- I grabbed the POI blanket and I stood at parade rest for, 'Stand by for count.'

They announce, 'Stand by for count.'So, I sat that for maybe two to three minutes with the POI blankets over me, sitting upright, because I wasn't allowed to lay down with the lights on.

And then I stood at parade rest with the blanket until and I couldn't see because of my glasses were taken away.

So, one of the guard-- the guard that was in the observation booth opened the door a crack and stated-- he stated or asked, 'Is that you stand at parade rest, detainee Manning?'

And I say-- I wanted to clarify, you know, if he-- if he wanted-- I requested if he wanted me to place it-- and he-- I don't recall if he said, 'You know what to do,' or something like that, but I knew, you know, I knew it was an indirect command.

So, I placed my POI blanket back on the mattress, and stood at parade rest.

Defense (Coombs)

And the time that you are standing at parade rest at that point--

Pfc. Manning

--and I said-- I said, 'No, Lance Corporal' to, 'Is that how you stand at parade rest?' I said, 'No, Lance Corporal.' I guessed at the rank, because I couldn't see him.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So, went you put the blanker back and stood back at parade rest, you had no clothing on at that point?

Pfc. Manning

Yeah. I had no socks, no underwear, nothing.I had no articles of clothing.I didn't have glasses.So, no.No, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, where were you standing as far as your cell?

Pfc. Manning

At the door.The same door that you see in the video, and it's right at the front of the cell. I don't know if it was 191 or 192. But at the front of the cell, Sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Was the cell door open or closed at that point?

Pfc. Manning

The cell door was closed.They don't-- I mean, they don't--I 'm on POI status at this time, they don't-- The only time they open the door is if I am in full restraints, sir.Or if there is an immediate emergency, medical emergency.

Defense (Coombs)

And, while you are standing there naked at parade rest, did anyone come out of the observation booth and direct you at that point, 'Private Manning, cover yourself with the blanket'?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, what happens next?

Pfc. Manning

Well, they announce-- because they can see-- because in the observation booth they have cameras.

They announce ahead of time the fact that alpha row door to the housing unit was about to open, and so they announce, you know, 'Stand by for count,' you know. 'Stand by for Count,' again. And then, [with a Marine Corps voice] 'Special Quarters, Attention,' or 'Ten-hun' in the Marines Corps, they don't-- I don't know how exactly they say it, but they called us to attention.

And, I stood at attention, and then the DBS, who was wearing-- who was wearing-- who was wearing the [missed word] cap, Marine Corps uniform.

So, I knew it wasn't GM 2 Webb.So, it was a Marine-- so, it was the Marine DBS passed by and did his.

And I saw the-- I can't see detail, so I couldn't see the face.I couldn't see rank. I knew it was a DBS.But, you know I saw the knife hand for the count, and then he passed by, and then-- and then everything continued as normal.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright--

Pfc. Manning

--and then they called us back to parade rest after. And, then they announced, 'Count clear,' you know.Over-- they open the door and said, 'Count clear,' you know, or, 'Carry on.'

So, I-- and, then I proceeded to sit back down on the-- on the-- one the mattress until the guard came by with my clothing and glasses.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so.The time period that you are up front standing naked and they announce the-- the fact that they are going to do the count, how long are you there standing naked either at parade rest or attention before the count is done.

Pfc. Manning

I was standing at parade rest for about three minutes.

Standing at attention for a minute and a half to conduct count, and then I was standing at parade rest for another three or four minutes until they complete the-- until they do the, 'All clear.'The DBS calls 'Count Clear' over the [missed word].

Defense (Coombs)

And, when-- and you said once--

Pfc. Manning

--[missed] at that point.

Defense (Coombs)

--you said once the count was clear then you returned back to your rack and covered yourself up with your POI blanket?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, at the time that you are standing here naked, and you are doing the count.

At any point does the DBS or anyone else then say to you, 'Private Manning' or 'Detainee Manning, go cover yourself with your blanket'?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, after they complete that count, and you are sitting on your rack, with your blanket covering you.How much time goes by before they give you your clothes?

Pfc. Manning

Only about a minute or two. I mean it was fairly quickly after that.It was that they-- they waited for the count, because they brought me a razor.

They set the razor on the feed tray for-- along with my clothes for-- to shave my face, and I put it back.And, we continued on until the morning.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So then the end of 3 March, what happened?Is your underwear taken away at the end of that day?

Pfc. Manning

At the end of the night, yes, sir.At taps.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay, and again, what are you sleeping with in your bed at that point?

Pfc. Manning

The two POI blankets from-- as a carry over from the winter, and the mattress.

And, those are the only-- those are the only articles in the cell that are not affixed to anything.They're not-- a part from my person.

So, it's my person, the mattress, and two blankets, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, on the morning of 4 March, what happens?

Pfc. Manning

On the next day, they give-- they call-- they-- they-- actually my clothing-- whenever they announced, 'Reveille Reveille Reveille,' my clothing was in the feed tray-- already handing over.So, I grabbed that.I put it on.They I stood by for count.

Defense (Coombs)

So, on that morning when you were standing for count, were you naked?

Pfc. Manning

For, 'Stand By for Count' and for 'Count' I was in the clothing that I was authorized.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. And, at the end of 4 March, what happens?

Pfc. Manning

At the end of 4 March, I have-- I am returned-- it's the same procedure.

I give them my clothing, and then I have the two prevention of injury blankets, the mattress with the built in pillow, and-- and my person.

Defense (Coombs)

On the morning of the 5th of March, what happens?

Pfc. Manning

The morning of the 5th-- the third day that we-- that we did this, they called, 'Reveille Reveille Reveille'.

I snap to parade rest.The last instruction-- the last instruction that I had been given from the previous-- from the previous day, from those days of before, was not to have a blanket over me or the implied instructions.

So, I stood at parade rest.And, they placed-- and then the guard ran into my cell and placed my clothing, and then I put my clothing on, and then-- then they called count as I-- and I had-- I was-- I was just about dressed whenever they announced count.

So, I was put at attention and the DBS counted me.Then I was at.I was clothed by that time, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so.For when they-- they announced, 'Get Ready For the Count,' you were standing naked, and then somebody you said from the observation room ran out to give you your clothes?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.Yes.

Defense (Coombs)

The morning of the-- well at the ending of the 5th, I imagine you gave back your underwear again?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, we continued on with the regular procedure.I don't know how many days it was before I was given the prevention of injury blanket?

Defense (Coombs)

You mean the smock?

Pfc. Manning

--the smock.Because, I had mentioned the fact that I had to-- by this time I had, you know, I had to stand at parade rest like that.I felt it was odd.At that time, I felt it was odd.Maybe, not.I don't know what to tell them.But, you know--

Defense (Coombs)

How many times, did you ever have any other occurrences where you were standing at parade rest naked in the morning other than the 3rd and the 5th?

Pfc. Manning

No. They started to put my clothing into the feed tray at-- about five or 10 minutes before they announced, 'Reveille Reveille Reveille'.

So, as soon as the lights come on, and they announce,'Reveille Reveille Reveille,' the clothing is there.

So, I can grab it, put it on, and put my glasses on.

So, I can see what is going on, you know.

Defense (Coombs)

And, at some point you say that you got the suicide smock?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I don't recall-- I think it was the 7th.I actually got it, on the morning of the 7th, it would have been, I grabbed my clothing ten minutes before, they would have put it there before-- announcing reveille and lights on.

And, then I grabbed my clothing.I put it on that day, but that was before the smock.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, after this time period, was there ever a day in which you did not have to surrender your underwear at night, before you left to go to the JFCF [Joint Regional Correction Facility Leavenworth on 20 April 2012]?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. They would give me my-- they would give me the smock, maybe, five minutes before they announced taps. ' 'Taps. Taps. Taps,' was what they would announce.

They would stuff the-- the smock into the feed tray.I would receive it, and I would place-- then I would put it on, and then I would undress with the smock sort of over me as a blanket.And then I would wrap it up--

Defense (Coombs)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

--sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. Before we going into our next and last section, if I could.Can we have another fifteen minute break?

Judge Lind

Any objection?

Prosecution (Fein)

No, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Alright Court is in recess then until 20 minutes to 19 hundred, or seven o'clock.

ALL RISE.

ALL RISE.

Judge Lind

Please be seated. This Article 39(a) Session is called to order.Let the record reflect all parties present when the Court last recessed are again present in Court.

Defense (Coombs)

Pfc. Manning, I again remind you that you're under oath.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. I'd like to talk to you now about your relationship with CW2 Barnes, the Brig OIC, who replaced Chief Averhart.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall, well she reports that your communication with her changed overtime, were you became more quiet and withdrawn.

Is that your memory of the events?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. That is correct, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, why did you become more quiet with her onward?

Pfc. Manning

Well, when I first met Chief Warrant Officer Two Barnes, I realized that she was replacing and-- although she was replacing the role of the-- of being the Brig OIC.

So, and I knew that-- I mean-- and I knew sort of-- I knew generally, at that time-- I knew specifically what her role in the process of my status was at that time.

So, I felt that-- I felt that perhaps, you know, she might listen or look at things differently-- look at the-- the information involved with making these determinations-- these final determinations.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you have a conversation with were you talked about stuff?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I remember being more forthcoming at the very beginning with-- with Chief Warrant Officer Two Barnes, because I-- I mean I thought that she might-- she might look at things differently so I want to-- I certainly wanted to engage her, and-- and make her feel comfortable.

Defense (Coombs)

Now during your conversations, who else was present, besides you and Chief Barnes?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean it might have been a counselor present, the counselor, Master Sergeant Blenis or then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis, or Staff Sergeant Jordan played a small role-- a smaller role as the counselor.

But, I don't recall, and then Master Sergeant Papakie, being the NCOIC-- was the-- it's more of an Army term, but 'battle buddy' of the OIC, so.

Defense (Coombs)

And, where were these conversations taking place between you and Chief Barnes?

Pfc. Manning

The most significant one that I-- the most significant ones that I remember, were when she first spoke with me.

She actually pulled me out of my cell, and sat me down in the conference area.

We talked and she, you know, explained the fact that she was the new OIC and she wanted to talk to me, and get to sort of know me better, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, did you have another conversation with her, where you started asking her about what she needed to do to get off of POI?

Pfc. Manning

Yes [missed two or three words] almost all of the early conversations involved that questions, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, at any point during the conversation did there become an issue of a conflict between you and Chief Barnes?

Pfc. Manning

I don't-- I don't recall when.I think it might have been more towards the March timeframe.Early March.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what do you recall from that?

Pfc. Manning

I remember.I started--After-- after some-- after being there for a few weeks, you know-- I started to feel like this was just a continuation of Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart on just-- I felt like she was just-- she was looking at everything from the same-- through the same lens-- just maybe with a slightly different way of-- of carrying herself and explaining the same things, I guess.The same justifications for her-- for her decisions.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you bring that up with her?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I did. And, I mean started to get frustrated with the whole process.

And I spent most of the time listening at first to her, and then whenever-- and I feel like I, you know-- she took me down, she sat me down.

So, I was sitting down in restraints, across from her on the table.I mean, not really 'across', but you know, we had a corner of the table.

So, you know, we are not exactly far apart from each other.She-- and then, you know, she allowed me then to speak my mind a little bit.

But, as I am speaking my mind, she stops me and she says, 'Oh, may I remind you that I am a Chief Warrant Officer Two in the Marines Corp and that you are a junior enlisted detainee,' and you know, 'the rank still applies here,' you know, and so that, you know--

And I was, you know-- I was-- I was a little frustrated, but I am not trying to be disrespectful, and I told her, you know 'I apologize that if I seem like I am being disrespectful, but I'm just trying to get my,' you know-- my sense of things across to her, you know-- to her.

And, but you know, everything that-- whenever I am going to say something, she would just say, you know, 'You are being disrespectful.' And, 'You're not,' you know, 'adhering to the,' you know, 'the policy of being respectful to me as a-- as a Chief Warrant Officer.'

So, I just felt-- sort of after that-- I didn't feel like-- I felt like anytime I spoke my mind, you know-- even if I was standing at attention and being as, you know-- saying, 'Ma'am' as many times as, you know-- I was still going to be disrespectful to her.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you apologize for the perception of being disrespectful?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, and as I just said, I apologized-- I mean, I apologized for, 'If it seems like I am coming across as disrespectful, it's not-- it's not that I am trying to be disrespectful, Ma'am.I am just trying to-- to convey my thoughts-- like to convey my opinions on things and,' you know, there was a word-- I mean, I think it was 'absurd'.

You know, I don't feel like it is inherently, you know-- disrespectful word.But that was my opinion of how I felt the conditions were at that point.

And, I feltthat the justification just seemed absurd to me.And, she found that disrespectful.And, I apologized, and I tried to find different language. And, I think the second time that phrase came out in that conversation.

Defense (Coombs)

At any point, during the conversation, did she tell you that you needed to be careful what you said, because if it did go to sentencing what you said could be used against you to hurt you?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. And, that-- I took that as a threat, not as, you know-- I took that as a threat that, 'If you-- if you continue to-- if you continue to question my authority,'this is what I am reading from it, 'If you continue to question my authority, then,' you know, 'we are going to make it look like you are being disrespectful, and being belligerent.'

I realized then that, you know-- I am dealing with a facility was-- that dealing with the facility 'at level' or trying to communicate my thoughts and opinions like that would be dangerous, at that point.

I felt-- I felt like it was-- it was-- that she was setting up a mind field at that point. That's how I felt.I mean--

Defense (Coombs)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

So.

Defense (Coombs)

So, from that point forward, did you feel that it was in your best interest to speak with the staff at the Brig?

Pfc. Manning

I was less trustful or-- I don't know is that a word, 'trustful'?

I trusted the facility less, my trust went down for, you know-- same with Master Sergeant Blenis and Master Sergeant Papakie, and you know, just, you know--

I figured, you know, I have other channels to go through now, and those are the one's that I am going to be [missed word] upon to the Article 138 complaint.

And, I mean, if we had exhausted the remedies, and we hadn't even considered whether to extraordinary relief to the Army Court of Criminal Appeals.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. Let's-- let's talk about and incident in March of 2011, where you removed some people from your visitation list?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you remember how many people in general you removed?

Pfc. Manning

[Missed first word] a large number of people.I had put a version of everybody that I could I think of that I had an address or a name for on my visitation list when I arrived at the facility, and I added a couple more to it over time as people conveyed to me that they wanted to be on the visitation list.

A lot of people just didn't either show up or, you know-- and then it ended up that I just, you know-- I don't remember what the question was, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you remove a lot of people from your visitation list in March?

Pfc. Manning

In March, yes, I did.

Defense (Coombs)

And, why--

Pfc. Manning

Well, it wasn't my intent to remove a lot of people.

I intended on removing two people in particular, being my father and Mr. David House at that particular time.

A friend of mine and my father.

So, Mr. David House was a friend of mine, or not really a friend, an acquaintance of mine through another friend, that started-- that was visiting me.

And, whenever I was given the paperwork, they told me that I had to redo all the paperwork, because a lot of it contained, you know, a lot of mistakes and was out of date and so forth.

So, I just condensed the list to people that I knew were actually going to come and visit or a part from the two that I had-- that I had focused on removing, which were my father and Mr. House.

Defense (Coombs)

Why did you remove your father from your visitation list?

Pfc. Manning

My father. He had come by a few times. I don't recall the exact dates, and, you know, he had conveyed to me, you know-- we just talked-- I mean we just talked, you know, in general a couple times about things, and then-- and then I remember--

I don't remember exactly what it was, but in early 2011, and he came by, and I think-- I think it was in March, and he came by out of the blue, and it was early 2011, but he did an interview later on that day with like, I think it was PBS Frontline, or something like that.

And, I had just had this conversation with him that day about, you know, how I am glad that, you know, nobody from the family is really engaging in doing interviews or press or anything like that, and you know, 'I am glad that you aren't doing that,' and he said, 'Well,' you know, 'I don't-- I'm not going to do that,' sir-- you know, and he did that, that same day.

But, it didn't-- we didn't know this until later of course.But, whenever I found that out I just-- I didn't want to deal with my father in that sense, because I knew that he had-- I found out that he had just taken advantage of the opportunity to fly, you know-- to get free tickets to go somewhere.

Or, at least that is how I felt, so.

Defense (Coombs)

So, you didn't want people going to the media?

Pfc. Manning

Particularly, my family and-- and then the other person who I removed is Mr. David House-- because he had visited the facility a few times and I had talked to him, and I was like, you know, 'I don't want to stir up the press or anything, so please,' you know, 'just, if you are going to visit me, just realize, that we are at this level of trust, where,' you know, 'I just want you to talk to me, and be a friend,' you know, 'if you want to be my friend,' cause we were acquaintances.

We met in early, early 2010, and we had met-- we had a mutual friend, Danny Clark-- this was Daniel Clark.Clark was his name.And, you know, he had visited with Mr. Clark before, and-- and we, you know-- we had these conversations, and then I realized over time that he was-- that he was immediately going to like blogs, like to a particular blogger, I forgot her name, but she-- and then-- and then there were these discrepancies, like he was saying things that I didn't necessarily feel that were helpful for-- and especially since, you know, we were just talking about, again, how I didn't want him to go straight to the media immediately following-- immediately following, you know-- visitation with me at-- you know, I just wanted-- I just wanted somebody to talk to, you know, a friend-- to be a friend, you know-- or a family member, not somebody to-- to take advantage of that, or use it as a soap box type--

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so.Let's now talk about 20 April 2011.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

When you are pulled out of your cell on that day, do you-- do you know where you are going?

Pfc. Manning

On 20-- on the morning of 20 April, everything had moved as normal until about zero seven in the morning. I would say.

And, Master Sergeant Papakie came by, and said, 'Get your stuff ready,' you know, 'inventory your items and everything.You are moving to Leavenworth.'And, that was what he said, so.

Defense (Coombs)

And, so on that morning then what happened?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I didn't have much stuff in my cell to begin with-- what I was transferred with.

They put me in full restraints.Moved me to the cell adjacent to me, and put me into the cell with all of my belongings and everything.

Removed the-- part of the restraints, and then I started to pack my things, and put it into a container-- like all of the soap dishes and, you know, uniforms and stuff.

And, then there was a trash bag, which I threw away a bunch of other, you know, stuff, and then-- and then they carried-- they put me back in the restraints, and moved to the out-processing and in processing area of the Brig.

And, with-- and they carried the container with all my belongings, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, then once you were out-processed from the Brig, where did you go?

Pfc. Manning

I was out-processed-- I mean, well I was out-processed into the-- the-- the in processing and out-processing area, whichever it was.

They inventoried my things, and that period, and then I-- I remember there was some Army officials particularly, Mr. Stroebel, I believe was his name.And, he had a PMG [Provost Marshal General] shirt.That's [missed word] there from Provost Marshal General shirt, and he said that-- he explained to me the process of what was going on.

That I was being transferred.And how that transfer was going to work.You know, how the flight and everything was going to work.How the timing and everything was going to work.And, you know-- that he was the-- he essentially called himself, the 'OIC of the transfer,'the Officer in Charge, sir.

But-- we then moved out of the facility, where there was a lot of-- it was like a bunch of-- there were a lot of soldier-- soldier uniforms, ACU's.

But, they were CID personnel.So they were Chief Warrant Officer Four et cetera.

But, I mean there as a lot of weird movement and stuff, and I was transferred to the Quantico airfield, in I think a [missed word] of police.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright. So, let's skip now to arriving at Fort Leavenworth, okay?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, when you arrive at Fort-- Fort Leavenworth, what happens when you start to in process at the JRCF?

Pfc. Manning

We brought-- they brought me to-- they brought me-- they brought me into the intake area directly.

So, I didn't see the outside of the facility.They brought me into basically the in processing section of the facility.

They removed my restraints.They removed-- I had some-- I had some kind of body armor on.

They removed that, and then I had JRCF personnel-- told me to face the wall, instead of parade rest. Told me what-- then I was-- then they brought me through the in processing process-- the intake process at JRCF, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, as you started to go through the in processing process, did they ever place restraints back on you?

Pfc. Manning

They did not.And, that surprised me.

They took. They removed the restraints and they brought me-- and they strip searched me, and then they showered me, and they did scars, marks, tattoos.I do it every time I come in and out.Same thing.

But, they strip searched me-- I mean, after the strip search, they showered me.

Then, they brought me out, and throughout this entire process, no restraints.

No. I am standing, you know-- I am walking freely with just the in processing NCO guiding me through the process, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

How did it feel to be walking around out without restraints?

Pfc. Manning

Awkward. I-- I was waiting for them to put me in restraints throughout the process, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And when then didn't happen, what were you thinking?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean-- I didn't think too much-- I was concerned about it, but they--

Defense (Coombs)

Why were you concerned?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean I am not used to being outside of anything without restraints at that point in time.

You know, I was expecting them, you know, to put me back on the status that I was before, you know, just at a different facility, you know.

And, then they brought me to-- it was actually.The NCO, Staff Sergeant, brought me to the-- gave me-- issued me some items, and brought me to the cell.

And, closed the door.Then, the door closed, and then I was in the cell.But, I had like sheets, blankets.

Defense (Coombs)

Yeah, what did you have in your cell at that point?

Pfc. Manning

It wasn't much that had been issued, because it's a-- there's a-- it's a several day process when they do that.

But, I had T-Shirt, shorts, a couple pairs of tan khaki-- like uniform, and sheets, blankets, pillow, and some toiletry items.

And, these were all in my cell, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what were you thinking at the point now you are now in your cell and you see all these items?

Pfc. Manning

Oh, this is completely different from Quantico Base Brig.I would-- I don't know-- I didn't know what to think of it, you know--

I thought-- I thought it was a huge upgrade-- I mean, certainly-- but, you know, there was this feeling of, the sense of-- you know, 'Okay.I know that they are gonna put the hammer down on me, you know, soon.'

I felt that coming, that sense.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you scared at this point?

Pfc. Manning

I wasn't scared at all.I mean I was just concerned, you know-- and I knew-- I had gotten use to-- I had gotten use to these procedures, and just assumed that they would be re-implemented at some point.

I thought somebody in the Chain of Command just-- there might have been a miscommunication of something, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, then the next morning starts and what happens?

Pfc. Manning

The next morning comes, the door opens and I am lead out-- well, nobody leads me out.

They just go over the intercom and say, you know, 'Manning. You've got medical...'

I received-- I had a blood test.I had my blood drawn, by a nurse outside of my cell, sir.There as no restraints or anything like that.I thought, again, I wasn't use to that.

Defense (Coombs)

And, you said how long was this indoctrination process?

Pfc. Manning

It was a couple days. They brought-- I mean they later, in that morning had took me out of the cell, and-- or they opened the door again.So, it just opens up.

And, then they tell me to come out, or get into-- get into my uniform.Come out. And, I go to a line up with another pretrial-- and some other post trial detainees, or inmates.

They separated us and then we were led off to a classroom for several hours.

We did this for a couple of days.They issued more items-- and fill out more paperwork, and see more people, and just-- this took about six or seven days, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when you are in the classroom-- is this like a classroom, where I would expect there are desks and you are just sitting at the desk?

Pfc. Manning

Well it's a-- they call it a classroom but it's a conference room.

And, everybody is-- they have-- they have the post trial inmates that are being across us at one side of the table.

And, the-- they had the two other pre-trials, me, and pre-trial.And, we sat together, and I was able to talk to him.

I was-- I wasn't sure if I was suppose to. [slight laugh)]If I was suppose to talk to him or not, but, you know, I did.

And, you know-- it was just weird.It was unusual, and being out and about and like not having a list-- not being having like four people move-- be involved in my movement, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Were you ever concerned at some point that what you were doing was wrong, by being able-- by talking and being out of your cell without restraints?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I thought somebody was going to fix what was wrong in terms of my status, you know.

I thought that it was a-- again, I kept on thinking, 'Oh. Yeah.It's been a miscommunication,' and you know, 'They are going to change my status. Then, after the status report or the status changes, and that's-- that's'

But, that was what I was used to-- was miscommunication that occurring-- and then, them being fixed, so.

I just expected the same at the JRCF, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

How long before you realized that-- well I guess after the indoctrination process, you were placed in [missed word] 'Medium Custody'?

How long for you did it take for you to realize that, that was your new life, now?

Pfc. Manning

It took-- it took a few days for me to realize that, you know, this is my new home, and this is how things are going to be.

But, I didn't really get use to interacting with the other pre-trials for several weeks.

It actually might have-- I would say it was probably about a month to a month and a half before I really felt comfortable talking with people, and being out of my cell without restraints, and everything else.

I just wasn't-- I wasn't use to it, and it was different, and, you know, it was just-- I mean, at first I was almost uncomfortable, because I wasn't sure what to do, or what I was allowed to do.

I felt like-- I felt like if I was outside of the cell, I was doing something wrong.

So, I know I just stand at parade rest for, you know, for whatever-- And, you know-- and the guards looked at me like I was funny.And then I-- so, I started to stop doing that.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, as you started to get adjusted to your new life at the JRCF, did-- did you ever try to harm yourself now that you were in at 'Medium Custody In'?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you ever try to escape?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did there come a time that you were involved with another detainee in a physical dispute?

Pfc. Manning

Another pretrial inmate, yes.

There was a-- there was an altercation in December of 2011.That was about a week before the Article 32, yes.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what happened?

Pfc. Manning

You know-- I mean I had been there for a while.

We actually moved housing units into this [missed word] housing-- a housing unit where pre-trials were held in a housing unit, separate from everybody else.

But, you know-- So I was in the cell-- I was in my cell.And, then it was like afternoon-- it was a Saturday.

So, I, you know-- I was just-- was mostly just sleeping, cause it's a Saturday and I felt like sleeping that afternoon.Just to take a nap.

And, I got out, and it was time for chow.So, I-- I stood by for chow, to get frisk searched. And, then I remember-- I remember the feeling that-- that this particular inmate was-- was-- sort of, just making fun of me, and attacking me, and just sort of a theory I had-- I am not use-- I am not use to this sort of-- and I had just woken up-- and I was sort of drowsy as well.

So, I mean, he started to-- I felt like he started to-- to attack me verbally. And, you know-- and I tried to ignore it, because this is something-- this is not unusual, but the intensity and the-- the intensity of this.

And, I have never had-- I've never felt like-- I never felt this point this sense of verbal attack-- and then verbal attack, and then me being, you know-- this sense, you know, being made fun of for not responding to it, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

You apparently did respond to it in a way in which you got into trouble?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Yes, sir.I did.I-- I don't know what was said.He said-- this particular-- I felt that this particular inmate said directly something to me.

And, I-- I responded.I mean, I just moved in and I-- and I went-- and I-- and I tried to punch him.

I mean I guess I tried to go for the face, but I ended up hitting the shoulder of this-- taller, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, then after that were you punished?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean I was removed from the housing unit at that point.

I was-- we went out separate ways, and there was an investigation period.

And, then there was a break, because we went-- I transferred here for the Article 32.

Now, there was a sense of the tension from the Article 32 that week as well.The upcoming Article 32.And, then it resumed as soon as I got back in January, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you successfully complete your punishment?

Pfc. Manning

I was given, 15 days of disciplinary segregation.And, fourteen days of extra duty.

And, I completed my-- the last day of extra duty the exact date, that I was transferred for the arraignment.

So, yes, I completed-- I completed everything involved with that.

Defense (Coombs)

And, since that incident, have you ever had any difficulty or problems at the JRCF?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, finally.When you left were seeing-- when you left Quantico, you were seeing a forensic psychiatrist on a weekly basis.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--when you got to the JRCF did you continue to see other forensic psychiatrists?

Pfc. Manning

Not a psychiatrist.There was a psychologist,who worked primarily at the disciplinary barracks, and she was there for my in processing as well.

Well, she came in after I was-- been-- going through the in processing.

And, introduced herself, and I told her I wasn't comfortable with-- I didn't-- I mean, she had been working at the JRCF full time.

She worked at the disciplinary barracks across the street.And so, she-- I mean it was a brand new facility as well, but, you know, I talked to her.

I talked to her on-- on a-- once a-- once a month or so, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, at this point-- did there come a time where you no longer were being seen by any mental health professionals?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I haven't seen-- a clinical-- in a clinical sense a-- I don't know if-- if I seeing-- Doctor Galloway [sp.] in a clinical sense.

She said that she had been tasked by her, quote 'boss' unquote, you know, to talk to me.

And so, I would be pulled out for these appointments.And, I would go speak to her.And, I don't mind speaking to-- I didn't mind speaking to her, sir.

But, I don't know if you could consider that clinical.I-- I didn't see that in-- I didn't see her as being in a clinical role. But, if-- if she was, then that ended early this-- at the beginning of the year, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

In this year?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Right before the arraignment, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Thank you Pfc. Manning.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Your Honor.The United States recommends that we recess for the night.The defense and the United States recently coordinated on scheduling, and then possibly have an [RCM] 802 without scheduling to reconvene tomorrow morning at 09:30.

Judge Lind

Alright, any objection?

Defense (Coombs)

No objection, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Alright. That seems like a good point to do that.Let's get a start time for tomorrow.I assume you don't want to reconvene is that correct?

Prosecution (Fein)

Not tonight.

Judge Lind

Pfc. Manning, if you would go ahead and go back to your seat.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Ma'am.

[Manning gets up and moves back to the defense table.]

ALL RISE

[END OF DAY.]

See Transcript of US v Pfc. Manning, Article 39(a), 11/30/12

Judge Lind

Alright, Pfc. Manning. I believe you were on the stand.

Defense (Coombs)

Pfc. Manning, I remind you, you are under oath.

Prosecution (Fein)

Private First Class Manning, other than the one time I was in front of you briefly in the case, we have never actually spoken before today, correct?

Pfc. Manning

You mean in October of 2011? Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, November of 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, all the information that I have is based off of your witness testimony, discovery as you referenced yesterday, recordings, and only that information. Not, anything from you?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

What I would like to first focus your attention on Private Frist Class Manning is your cell, as you walked through yesterday, and comparing that to disciplinary cells that you were not ever actually in at Quantico, at least to the best of-- of the prosecution's knowledge.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You were in a standard cell under POI and MAX custody, correct?

Pfc. Manning

For Special Quarters?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you had three walls, a toilet, a sink, a rack, and the bars in front?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you are in a cell that had a skylight in the hallway?

Pfc. Manning

Further down the hallway, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, a wall of windows that we saw in the video, yesterday?

Pfc. Manning

There were windows at the end of the hallway, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, natural light could come into the windows, but necessarily directly through your bars, right in front of your cell?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You did not have a steel door, directly in front of you?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You didn't have a steel door in front of the bars that were...?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You did not live in the quarters that only had a small window or half, and that was available at Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And while at Quantico, you lived where all the other pretrial detainees lived?

Pfc. Manning

For a significant portion, yes, sir. I believe the first couple weeks I was there. They still had a housing unit-- another area where they had people.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

[Missed.]

Prosecution (Fein)

But when you-- when you for instance left to do rec hall, or go visit the counselor, had a defense attorney meeting, and you walked by at time other cells, and they were the same as yours?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now to talk about the smock that you-- you showed or you demonstrated for the Court yesterday.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yesterday, you testified at one point you were stuck in your smock and Corporal Sanders had to assist you in getting your arms out?

Pfc. Manning

[missed but affirmative as in, 'Yes, sir']

Prosecution (Fein)

And, another incident occurred on about 13 March 2011?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall the date. It was mid-March. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, that night that your arms got stuck, you decided to sleep with your arms inside the smock?

Pfc. Manning

I believe I got into that position as I was falling asleep. So, I-- I might have naturally just done that, not really aware of, you know, doing it purposely, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you were told not to put your arms inside of the smock?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

That you needed a blanket to cover up your arms if they got cold?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now to go...to go prior to showing up in Quantico. I'd like to focus your attention on Kuwait.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

While in Kuwait you admitted to being suicidal?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You admitted to making two nooses and scavenged for metal objects that could cause harm to yourself?

Pfc. Manning

I don't know about the metal objects. And, I don't know about two nooses.

I certainly made one...I certainly made one that I know of, sir. I-- the sheet noose, in particular, the one that I remember, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, when speaking to your psychiatrist downrange, Captain Richardson.--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--about your suicidal ideation, did you describe yourself as being patient?

Pfc. Manning

I'm not-- I'm not sure. I just remember being patient wanting to get off of suicide risk. I don't know if there was a misinterpretation of that. But, I could see how my words were construed that way or [missed a few words] Captain Richardson.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And then-- when you arrived in Quantico-- well you arrived in Quantico on 29 July 2010?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, when you arrived on your in processing form, you stated to the question, 'Have you ever considered suicide?' you checked the box, yes?

Pfc. Manning

I was-- I was told that I had to by-- I mean, they didn't tell me I had to. They said-- cause as I'm going through I have the-- I had the guards assisting-- assisting me.

I mean I was-- I was in restraints, so I couldn't complete the paperwork without them. And, I didn't think that they were sort of observing whatever I wrote, and everything else.

But, they-- Corporal-- then Corporal Hanks-- Gunnery Sergeant Hanks instructed-- instructed me that I had to answer everything in particular-- in that row and I did not. I mean I did do that. I put a 'not' in there, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, he didn't order you to say, 'Yes' or 'No' in the check box?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, Sir. He just asked the question, you know, 'You are on suicide risk. You were on suicide risk in Kuwait. Shouldn't you...?' It was more of an implied question, rather than order, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, for the question, 'Have you ever considered suicide?' you checked the box, yes?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, then on that same form there is a space to where you can fill in any comments?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you, in your own handwriting wrote, 'Always planning, and never acting'.

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I was told that if I checked the box that I had to put something down in that particular location. I could have put [missed word]. I could have put something in...something other than that. That is what I put down there, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now to speak about the two nooses, what has been marked as-- well photo substitution as appellate exhibit 416, your Honor. Do you recognize this sheet?

Pfc. Manning

I do, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You do?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Is this the sheet that you made a noose out of?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Your Honor, what has been marked as appellate exhibit 417. Private First Class Manning, do you recognize these sandbag ties?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Those were found-- I was told that those were found in my cell, and yes, they are sandbag ties.

Prosecution (Fein)

And the noose that you made out of these sandbag ties?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall-- I don't recall constructing a noosed out of them, but they were found in my cell.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. What about the two metal objects that were also collected by CID at the same time?

Pfc. Manning

Those were found in my-- near my cell, or outside my cell, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Now to focus your time, or continue to focusing your time at the beginning-- your time at Quantico, when asked by Gunny Blenis at the beginning when you started at Quantico, you told him that you had made a noose out of sandbag ties?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. I told him that sandbag-- that I had [missed] had been to me that sandbag ties were found in my cell at a particular moment, and that I didn't just do that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, but you also-- didn't-- well, did you tell him about the bed sheet noose?

Pfc. Manning

I did, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

That is his-- just to be clear I am talking about when you first arrived, in your first counseling session.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Not in subsequent ones?

Pfc. Manning

End of July 2010.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes.

Pfc. Manning

[Missed. Not clear if Manning said, 'about that time']

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, you did or did not tell him also about the two metal objects that were also found?

Pfc. Manning

I did not.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, what I would like to do now is-- is kind of the same line of questioning about your suicidal ideations, focus on 7 January 2011? As you probably remember yesterday you testified that, that is when you finally decided to submit a chit, a DD Form 5-10, about your POI status?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, that was on 7 January? That date is when you decided to ask for a review of your classification status?

Pfc. Manning

To the commander, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, and can you describe for the Court the process of how you submit that chit to the commander?

Pfc. Manning

I requested for a DD Form 5-10, which is-- the Marines Corps calls it's forms 'chits'. So, it is referred to as a 5-10 'chit'.

And then I requested for-- and I had to do this during correspondence time, sir.

So, I was given a pen. And, I filled out-- I filled out the necessary portion section 'request to'. And, I kept-- and I filled out one, and then I filled out another, labeled as 'copy', and then initialed that one, which I'd have, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then once you fill out the document, what do you physically do with it?

Pfc. Manning

I had the option of either giving to the guard or requesting for the cart to actually be-- for the special-- for the forms that were written for the commander had a cart, in which there were two mail boxes. One for, I think the Inspector General and one for the commander.

And, I place the one for the commander-- I asked, Lance Corporal Bell, to put it into the-- to the mailbox-- the box for the Brig CO [Commanding Officer] the [missed] outbox, or drop box.

And then, he placed it in it, or I-- or I did. So, [missed] through the feed tray, and put it in, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, so like this old ballot box had a lock on it?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, the guards can't just poke them in and take out anything that is submitted by a detainee?

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

So it's for the IG and the Brig CIO?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, so you submitted that on 21 January or 7 January?

Pfc. Manning

On 7...on 7 January, and I filled out two.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

So, I filled out one for my-- my [missed]. I put in a 5-10 chit in mid-December and I don't know if that ever got anywhere. If it got lost or [missed], sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, why didn't the...December was that in the box, or did you give that to the guard?

Pfc. Manning

I gave that to just the guard. I did not put it in the box.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, that was a chit that you filled out for anyone in the facility, but not the one specifically designed for the Brig CO [Commanding Officer]?

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, the one that you filled out on 7 January and dated 7 January on the top, right on the form, that one you submitted it went into the box, the locked box?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

When?

Pfc. Manning

That was 7 January of 2011?

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. And was that chit that you submitted to Chief Averhart in a locked box, was that responded to?

Pfc. Manning

Not immediately, Sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. But, when was it responded to?

Pfc. Manning

It might have been sometime a week maybe two weeks later. I had brought it up with my chain of command, like company commander, and then--

Prosecution (Fein)

--[missed]

Pfc. Manning

--it's Captain Casamatta. That was my company commander, so.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, what did you request in that chit?

Pfc. Manning

I requested-- I don't remember-- I don't remember-- I don't recall exactly what I was requesting from it, but essentially I outlined the sections of the Brig order that I looked at that I was referencing.

And, I requested for a Classification & Assignment board, or to at least to attend one or have-- have-- have one in regards to my prevention of injury status, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, on 21 January you went before the board?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, on 21 January 2011, you appeared before the C&A board?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I physically attended that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, when you attended there, you were asked why you had made the statement, 'Always planning, and never acting'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you answered then that-- that statement, when you had made it originally may have been false?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then another member of the board-- there's three members of the board?

Pfc. Manning

There were three in attendance. There was Gunnery Sergeant Blenis-- then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis, Gunnery Sergeant Fuller, and another like a member, but he's a Staff Sergeant. I don't recall.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, then another member of the board said, 'If that may have been false, then should we believe-- why should we believe whether you are going to harm yourself today?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

And you answered, 'yes' to that?

Pfc. Manning

It was a lot more of a-- it wasn't just the 'yes', sir. It was part of a-- of a lengthy sort of-- you know, philosophical-- I mean that was a philosophical question.

So, I did that-- said, 'This is a philosophical question, [missed word],' sir. It was a more general answer-- wasn't-- he wanted an intellectual answer to that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, what was the, I guess, the intellectual answer?

Pfc. Manning

I mean there's-- I mean, there's-- there's a lot of things in regards to, you know, whether something is false or otherwise something is true, you know-- if he was infallible and, you know it's hard to-- it's hard to gauge things, you know, without evidence. So, that-- I was just pretty broad with that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, what about evidence? But, then again on the form that they were referencing at the time and they were discussing--

Pfc. Manning

--that is correct, Sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--what you had written, which was 'Always planning'-- in your handwriting, 'Always planning, never acting'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But then you said, that you didn't really mean that?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, so this-- this intellectual conversation that you, I guess in your eyes, finally getting at the Brig, was about whether you meant it then or you were being truthful today, then, on 21 January, that you were not suicidal?

Pfc. Manning

I-- I thought it was more about-- about, at that particular time-- and I didn't-- I mean I didn't-- I didn't realize that they were trying to do that, but I was thinking at that particular moment.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, then after that the third member of the board actually reiterated and asked you, 'Do you understand the question?' Just to make sure there was no confusion, and you answered, 'yes'.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, on 21 January 2011, when you went before the board for the first time, when asked you still hadn't provided the Brig officials with a clear answer of what you meant, when you said, 'Always planning, never acting'?

Pfc. Manning

I did-- I did say that it might have been sarcastic, sir.

It was a sarcastic answer, given, you know, just out on a whim, because I knew I was going to be placed on suicide risk status.

I mean that was-- I had been told that. And, because I was placed on it in Kuwait, sir, it didn't really make a difference, what answer I gave, because-- I mean-- I was going to be placed on the same status, sir. [Missed a statement.]

Prosecution (Fein)

But, if that was the reason, then why would you ask then to go before the board?

Cause this was, you had said that this was your first chance that you had thought about, I mean that is what you said yesterday-- to get before the board to tell them your side of the story about why you shouldn't be on POI?

Pfc. Manning

Right.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, then when you are given the opportunity, you didn't-- you didn't take it?

Pfc. Manning

I did, as far-- as far I understood the process, I did. I just told them that today, you know-- in January 2011-- again January 2011, I am not suicidal.

I'm not trying-- I am not trying to harm myself or anything like that, you know, I didn't understand the relevance of-- and that one of the things-- and I think that was the issue I was having, is that I didn't understand the relevance of the July 29, 2010 form-- cause it was so far back.

I hadn't even-- I had actually forgotten that-- that had even been written down, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, on 21 January you're saying, something you actually said yesterday too, at that board your first chance to really confront these issues--

Pfc. Manning

--yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--that-- well, your thought of confronting these issues, you had forgotten what you had written down?

Pfc. Manning

I had forgotten about that form, yes. I forgotten about the intake form.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Are you familiar when you and your defense counsel submitted a 138 complaint?

Pfc. Manning

You know, sir, I know that I put-- I know that-- I think I told the Brig staff about it before it was filed--

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

--sir. I knew-- cause I knew what he was gathering, I just didn't know when Mr. Coombs had officially filed it, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, when he officially filed it on 19 January, two days before the board, that laid out everything we have been talking about, including the original form classification--

Pfc. Manning

--yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--you didn't know-- you didn't remember until 21 January that, that's what you wrote on the form?

Pfc. Manning

I had completely forgot about that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, even though on 18 January, when the video that we watched yesterday was filled, and you had the discussion with Chief Blenis about that, you didn't remember three days later at the C&A board?

Pfc. Manning

Wasn't the C&A before that, sir?

Prosecution (Fein)

No. The C&A board was on 21 January. The video that we watched yesterday was filmed on 18 January.

Pfc. Manning

Okay, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you had that discussion on that video we watched yesterday with Chief Blenis, about why did you write on the form, why did you make the nooses, why there are inconsistencies there, and you both had a dialogue back and forth...

Pfc. Manning

--parts of it.

Prosecution (Fein)

--so then when you had the chance to go before the board on 21 January, you didn't take that opportunity to even explain to the three board panel, why it was that you made that decision to write that down on the form?

Pfc. Manning

I did. I mean-- whenever asked about it, I did. At least, I felt I did, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you just said that you didn't remember writing that?

Pfc. Manning

I'd-- I'd forgotten about the form. That is what I said.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So in that 3 day period you had forgotten about the form?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

I would like to do now-- kind of-- direct your attention to-- is the different avenues that you had to logged complaints of seek redress.

You just spoke about one, and article 138 process. Did you know about the 138 process before being, I guess, detained in pretrial confinement?

Pfc. Manning

I had seen an ask.com article about it in 2009, but I had never really gotten into such-- the depth of it, sir.

So, I knew that it existed, sir, but not really in terms of exact context [missed a few words], sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

I assume also it is not something that is normally talked about everyday, the 138 process?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, Sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you did submit through counsel on 19 January an Article 138 complaint?

Pfc. Manning

In January, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, yesterday you testified about the MRE [Military Rules for Evidence] 305(g) re-evaluation of your pretrial confinement status to your UCMJ [Uniform Code of Military Justice] command, you submitted on 13 January 2011?

Pfc. Manning

That's the Special Court Martial Convening Authority?

Prosecution (Fein)

To Colonel Coffman?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You are also aware that-- that Mr. Coombs on your behalf, submitted to Chief Averhart directly a memo requesting re-evaluation on 5 January 2011?

Pfc. Manning

On 5 January? I don't-- I don't recall that one, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

I had put in-- I had put in the 5-10 not realizing that, that had [missed word], sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

I thought I was doing that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, I am actually talking about something completely different, so you did, at least from the documentation in discovery, you did file a 5-10; but I am just talking about separately on 5 January, that your defense counsel on your behalf submitted directly to Chief Averhart, a memo request?

Pfc. Manning

Okay, yes, sir. I did not-- I did not recall that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So-- so these three formal-- more formal requests were submitted on your behalf, and then like you just talked about, the fourth way, is you had the chit and DD 5-10 process either informally with a guard or formally through the locked box?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you also had other avenues to seek redress directly, didn't you? You did?

Pfc. Manning

I mean, I can verbally ask, that's one.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, Colonel Oltman visited you periodically?

Pfc. Manning

A colonel did, a Marines colonel. I don't-- I don't-- they came through periodically, sir. I don't-- they didn't really introduce themselves very [deeply?], sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Cause I don't think there were even name tags given?

Pfc. Manning

They do, but I don't-- I look at the rank first. Or I look at it--

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure. That makes sense. But, periodically Marines colonels, or a colonel, multiple colonels would come through? And, have discussion with you?

Pfc. Manning

I wouldn't-- well, they would come by and I would see them, and they would see me, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You had other avenues of using privileged communication?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir, [missed statement].

Prosecution (Fein)

[Missed] [Sergeant? David? First?]. He's a Chaplain, visit you?

Pfc. Manning

I did have a chaplain visit me, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Did you make any special requests to have certain chaplains visit you?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. We had a chaplain that came by weekly, if not weekly, then at least once or a few times a month, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you mentioned the IG. You know that you had a lock box that you could submit issues to the Inspector General?

Pfc. Manning

I did. I-- it was also, I 'm not familiar with how the [missed word] system works, because the requests [missed] system as well.

But, I-- on both of those, the Inspector General and request [missed] for the Marine Corps. I was not familiar with how that process works.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, when the cart would roll by there was a box that you could submit some papers in, at least, maybe a form, maybe not, but some-- something in a locked box to get to the IG?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Also, members of your command, they visited you, almost every week?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. At least once every week, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

We will talk about that in a little bit, but-- so, you had a lot of options to exercise as far as getting redress or lodging any forms of complaints about your treatments status or anything else going on?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you never asked the chaplain to help you with anything?

Pfc. Manning

No. I mentioned about the prevention of injury with the chaplain pretty frequently, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Did you ever ask a chaplain to assist you in understanding why or to change your status?

Pfc. Manning

I talked to him about it. I didn't necessarily make a formal request with him, but I mentioned the fact that I really wanted to get off of the status, and then I stopped.

I was surprised that I was still on it. And, you know we talked, and then-- he was somebody that, you know-- and we had-- he kept-- he was the only other person that I could talk to on sort of an 'at level' basis, sir.

But he had, I mean, he had other-- he didn't have a lot of time. So, I didn't [missed statement] him or anything. And, I am not-- I'm not a religious person, but [missed statement]. I would still talk with him.

Prosecution (Fein)

What do you mean by 'at level', like you just said it today, and you said it many times yesterday? What do you mean by 'at level' basis?

Pfc. Manning

It's-- it's-- there's a moment-- I mean as a junior enlisted person-- that I'm engaged at to where you can speak with a-- somebody that is of a higher rank with you, you know, where you-- the ranks are-- it's-- it's set aside for a moment, sir, but it [missed a phrase] a person to person conversation, as opposed to a subordinate and a superior, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Is it the rank that is set aside or is it just being completely relaxed and having this kind of intellectual conversation?

Pfc. Manning

It's-- it's-- I'd say it is both, sir. Cause-- I mean, you really do have to-- at that moment in my mind, sir, sort of set aside the fact that you're in a subordinate and a superior relationship.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, what was the Chaplain's name that you said you talked all the time about your POI status?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall his name. I filled-- I gave to-- I gave to-- I put-- I remember that I told Captain Casamatta his name whenever he put that down on the form. But, I don't-- I don't recall his name.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, it was a male chaplain?

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, maybe Marines don't have chaplains?

Pfc. Manning

I guess-- I guess he was. He wore the Marines Corps uniform, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. It was the ACU uniform?

Pfc. Manning

MARPATs.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Did you ever file anything into the IG slot that was locked and would go right to the IG?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Earlier you spoke about the chit's, DD form 5-10s?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you filed six chits while you're at Quantico, correct?

Pfc. Manning

I think I filed more, but some-- some-- they had a tendency-- some of the ones that were given just directly to the guards had a tendency of going missing.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well I think you are right, first off because I can't count [missed]. So, at least nine?

Pfc. Manning

I would say it would have to be at least-- at least a dozen, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And you knew about this chit DD form 5-10 process from the day you in-processed?

Pfc. Manning

From the day I in processed at Kuwait.

Prosecution (Fein)

Oh. You knew about it in Kuwait?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. All-- all military correction facilities utilized the DD form-- the DD form 5-10 system or a modification like that.

Prosecution (Fein)

What do they call it at the JRCF?

Pfc. Manning

They modify it to their military correctional complex 5-10 forms. So, that it's a modified DD form 5-10. They just remove some of the administrative things for the facility they use it as, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Does it have a common name other than like, 'chit' that they use at--

Pfc. Manning

Well--

Prosecution (Fein)

--[missed last few words].

Pfc. Manning

[Missed].

Prosecution (Fein)

Makes sense. I would like to go through some of these. If you don't remember, please let me know, and I will help refresh your memory?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The one that you dated on the 7th of January 2011, Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart, that was the one that you put into a locked box for him?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir. And I-- and I-- and I made a duplicate for my own purposes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And you wrote on there, 'request lifting' or 'subject for purposes of the interview'-- now they use the term interview, is it really-- does it always necessarily mean 'interview' like one on one interview?

Pfc. Manning

No. It's just the way the form is set up, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, what-- what is-- what is the different ways you can use this form?

Pfc. Manning

So, you can use it just to request to speak to somebody. You can sometimes use it just for anything-- put your-- just your request in general without wanting to see anybody.

You can-- basically it's your-- it's the formal-- it's the semi formal way of communicating with the staff at a correctional facility [missed word], sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, on this one dated 7 January, you wrote, 'request lifting your prevention of injury status and custody classification review including Brig justification of MAX custody status'? And, then you cited the different rules within the regulations?

Pfc. Manning

The-- the-- I only had access to the Brig Order at that time, sir, so.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, the rules and regulations of the Brig?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

On 4 January-- so one submitted three days beforehand, you did one requesting books from your aunt?

Pfc. Manning

4 January?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, 2011?

Pfc. Manning

2011? Yes, I think so.

Prosecution (Fein)

Specifically, even the books you were asking for you talked about yesterday, 'People's History of the United States', 'A Journey in my Political Life', 'Good Soldier' David Finkel-- so, you requested that. Did you get those books?

Pfc. Manning

Some of them. I put a-- I put a-- I put a broad list of them. I didn't-- they weren't necessarily books that I was going to receive. Just a-- I put a-- sort of a shot gun approach, which one's my aunt was going to send me.

Prosecution (Fein)

By shot gun approach, you mean just everything you could think of she'll send, and hopefully some of the-- some of them will show up?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, when they showed up, did you get those books by the Brig?

Pfc. Manning

Not-- not immediately, but I did eventually get them. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, they approved you receiving books, and you received them?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. They have a-- they have a process, but I forgot how exactly that worked, but they had a-- they had a process [missed a few words].

Prosecution (Fein)

On the 19th of December of 2010, you submitted a request for an emergency phone call with attorney reference Vice President Joseph Biden?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, did you get that phone call with your attorney?

Pfc. Manning

I don't know. I had a-- I eventually got an attorney phone call. I was requesting one more immediately than that, because I had heard something strange going on, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Well did you talk to him the next day at 12:25?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Sir. But, I-- I think the immediacy went away after that [missed].

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you didn't at the time necessarily know if it was cause your attorney couldn't be gotten a hold of or whether they couldn't figure out the system to make it happen?

Pfc. Manning

Correct. I'm not privy to that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure. On 13 December 2010, so a few days, almost a week before the Vice President Biden chit, you asked for 'request gift books from family and friends for online purchases do not know what the contents of the books are'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So is that again the shot gun approach [missed] you don't know even what they are, but you just want them?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. And, that was denied, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

I'm sorry, what?

Pfc. Manning

And, that was denied, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, and then how-- how about-- how did-- explain to the Court how it is you would know to even submit these chits for these types of requests.

Pfc. Manning

The process is outlined in there-- in the facility's 'Rules and Regulation for'-- that they issue to an inmate, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, I assume that no need to even [missed a few words ask? the? Marines?], you would find out from your family and friends that you were-- .they were intending to send you something?

Pfc. Manning

Sometimes in [conferences?], sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And-- and then you would then ask to get the ones that arrived [missed word]?

Pfc. Manning

Sometimes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then the Brig would have to react based off your request? Answer your requests?

Pfc. Manning

Of course. I mean [missed statement].

Prosecution (Fein)

So, on the 13 of December it was denied, but you were also told that it was denied that you needed some specificity, so they could put it through that process that you just spoke of?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

As you [missed] back in time, so the 21st of November 2010--

Pfc. Manning

--[missed phrase]

Prosecution (Fein)

--you asked to make an addition to your mailing and visitation list? This was for Glenn Greenwald, a friend from New York City?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. That is true.

Prosecution (Fein)

And so the mail and visitation list, this was a list of who could visit, who you authorized to visit and who you authorized to send you mail - anyone could send you mail - but, who you authorized to send you mail that you would receive?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct. That is [true?].

Prosecution (Fein)

Were you authorized or based off this request, were you allowed to add Mr. Glenn Greenwald to the list?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

On the 15th - again six days before - 15th of November 2010, you were requested receipt of periodical, monthly periodical, 'Scientific America'?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you even gave the ordered date? Did you receive authorization to get that periodical?

Pfc. Manning

Definitely. Yes, sir. [Missed last few words].

Prosecution (Fein)

Actually, you were very consistent. Six days, again before 9 November 2010, you requested a discussion regarding recording or monitoring of privileged communication and command conduct?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Will you please explain that?

Judge Lind

What was the date on that?

Prosecution (Fein)

I'm sorry, your Honor. 9 November 2010.

Pfc. Manning

It was-- I mean I don't-- I don't recall exactly what precipitated that, sir. But, I did generally have a concern about what was-- what was and what was not being recorded, whenever I was talking to the command and who was-- and-- and their-- the listening capability of using the phone that was in the backroom for the attorney phone calls.

Prosecution (Fein)

Can you-- can you please explain - kind of back up a little bit--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--I don't think yesterday you explained this-- just adding more detail for the Court.

Did you say backroom phone, explain, so--- I guess first question is: where did you typically speak to your attorneys for privileged communications?

Pfc. Manning

Privileged communications-- we'd-- normally took place, whenever they were telephonic, there was a telephone, a-- I'm guessing that a DSF phone or for that-- in special quarters it was, what use to be-- I mean they still have-- they still had the 'Chief's Office' sign on it.

I remember it was just a-- it was just sort of a storage area in which that telephone was there. There was a chair and a table.

And, they allowed or they had inmates, including myself, sit there and make-- we would hold the telephone up to the ear and talk to our counsel. The guard would put in the telephone number, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So they would put the telephone number in, and then you are in a closed office with privacy to talk to your...?

Pfc. Manning

Not always closed. No, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so you were concerned that it wasn't closed?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Sometimes the guards would sit in the room with me.

Prosecution (Fein)

During your conversations with your attorneys?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you were concerned about that and you told the Brig?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

And, I had the same concern regarding-- because, I had been told that or I had been notified that my visitations were being monitored and that I was filling out forms for visitors, and I was concerned--

I was confused about-- I was confused about whether or not that was the same for command, so between Captain Casamatta or First Sergeant Williams, whenever they came, whether they-- that fell under the same sort of service agreement with the Marines Corps.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, they weren't recorded, were they?

Pfc. Manning

I believe I was told that they were, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Did you sign forms every time?

Pfc. Manning

I did not--

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

--but the sign was still there, and so-- the Brig staff would advise me that all of my communications, except for-- except for clergy and attorney phone calls would be recorded, and then everything else could just be, you know, monitored by the guards, but not really recorded [missed last two words].

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you just wanted clarification of that, and then after that point you did not-- or before you never signed the consent to monitoring when you met with Captain Casamatta, Lieutenant [Barnard?], or First Sergeant Williams.

Pfc. Manning

I did not. I did not. I was told that-- that I did not need to [missed, but essentially did not sign a consent form because they were in the military, so they did not need to give consent for monitoring or recording]. They were not civilians.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And then the last part of that. That was when you had the confidential communications-- well, when you have your communications with defense counsel you would go to the other office.

What about telephone calls that were recorded or from your cell, how did that work?

Pfc. Manning

There was a-- and then there was a-- it was a phone that was on a cart, so it had wheels and a long wire which would go into the observation booth, and there was a-- you would pick up the phone and then there was-- it was a-- it would request for your pin number and a lot of other things.

I don't remember exactly how it work. There is a very similar system at the JRCF.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, because you were in MAX and POI status they would literally wheel a phone over to your-- to the front of your cell?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--[missed].

Pfc. Manning

If-- If I had requested it.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Now-- thank you. Going now to the next chit in the line on a-- I think it is 4 November 2010. You had a request for including pay [missed word], including getting copies of your leave and earning statements?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I wasn't sure where to direct those.

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure--

Pfc. Manning

--at the time, but eventually directed to-- to go through command for that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, they answered that chit as well?

Pfc. Manning

I don't believe that the facility had to, because-- it was not their responsibility.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Your command fixed that for you?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then on 7 August 2010, you requested 'disposition and accessibility of attorney delivered further for Major Hurley'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, can you explain what happened there?

Pfc. Manning

I had a-- I had a packet of documents that Major Hurley wanted to be received-- or that asked for-- for me to see-- or asked me to keep and go through, and those were confiscated and I never-- I still don't know what happened to this day with those documents.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you didn't-- so they never answered the chit or they could not find [missed word] what you were talking about?

Pfc. Manning

They told me that I was not allowed to have it, sir. And, that was-- it was being reviewed or something like that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Right. So, they answered it, but just not with an answer necessarily that-- that you-- you wanted or hoped to get?

Pfc. Manning

No. It wasn't an answer that I really understood.

So, I believe I received that answer from the Army liaison as opposed to Gunnery Sergeant Blenis-- or I think it was Staff Sergeant Jordan.

Prosecution (Fein)

It was the Army liaison, the Army rep at the facility?

Pfc. Manning

And, he was also a counselor, not necessarily my counselor, but a counselor, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Your Honor, the United States would like marked the-- these chits that we just went through.

Judge Lind

[Missed phrase]. Can I see them please?

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, Ma'am--

Judge Lind

Are you using them both?

Prosecution (Fein)

[to judge] No. No, your Honor. But, we would like them marked as 426(a).

So, if we do any other enclosures or a [missed a few words]. [to witness] Private First class Manning, so it's been almost an hour, do you need a comfort break?

Pfc. Manning

No. I'm good, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, few times-- right now command visits. Yesterday, you testified that you really liked your company commander, Captain Casamatta and First Sergeant [missed word] Williams.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, he's the best.

Prosecution (Fein)

First Sergeant Williams or Casamatta?

Pfc. Manning

Both of them, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

And-- and-- and then Lieutenant [Barnard? and Captain [Barn?] [missed word].

Prosecution (Fein)

And Captain [Barnard?] and First Sergeant Williams are your current company commander and First Sergeant?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

They are the ones who visited within 48 hours of your arriving at Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

Within 24 hours, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Within 24 hours. You also met your Battalion commander, I think, at that time, Lt. Col. Leiker?

Pfc. Manning

I met somebody from Operations, I believe it was the Operations Chief. It was an S3 like position.

I don't recall if it was somebody, who came in to represent the Battalion commander. And, then I actually met the Battalion commander within-- within a few days of arriving, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you arrive and your Army chain of command showed up to explain your new command structure and made sure that you understood that you aren't just being left in a sea of Marines?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, they visited you, you said, earlier this morning on average every other week about?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yesterday you gave an example of how you asked for a new tennis shoes or athletic shoes and they somehow even obtained your original ones from Fort Drum?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

While you visited with them, you had discussions with them, and then they always asked a series of questions?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

In fact, you became so good at answering questions that you would sometimes give them the answers, because you knew which questions were coming up next?

Pfc. Manning

If-- if the forms were the same, yes, sir. Because, they did change at some point the form, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, could you explain the form you are talking about to the Court?

Pfc. Manning

They would-- the company or I don't-- I don't-- I don't know what level, but the company was using a form for checking up on me, to make sure they ask the same questions for the command visit every single time as well as giving me the opportunity to-- to speak about any issues that might not necessarily be on the form.

So, there is a exhaustive list of about I think [130?] or something questions are on it.

Prosecution (Fein)

Your Honor, for your reference this is enclosure 26 to appellate exhibit 259, and, appellate exhibit 259 is the Government response to Article 13.

[to witness]

Private First Class Manning, what I would like to do is run through this form real quick. Just the generic example, not talking about any specific [missed]--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--[missed a few words] and then ask you a few questions about these questions. So, the form-- well, first there's one-- this-- this form was a two pages long?

Pfc. Manning

Double-sided maybe. I-- I think [missed word] more than two pages if it is not double-sided, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, sometimes you answered the questions by writing, and other times they asked you and they wrote it down?

Pfc. Manning

I-- I usually it was almost always verbal. They did it-- although one officer required an initial or something like that, but I don't recall when that was.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. But at the end of it, after you all had your discussion, and you went through the question on the form, then you would sign the form?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And date it?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir. Except for one occasion, when First Sergeant Williams did not have physical access to me. He-- I don't know what happened on that form, but I did not sign that form, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, I think there was actually I think a few occasions where-- where there wasn't a form used and it was just written out on a piece of paper?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Sometimes they would forget the form. But, we would still go through as many questions as we can to represent [missed word] their efforts.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, the first question, 'Do you have any medical conditions?' you have to answer 'yes' or 'no'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then it's [missed word] 'Have you requested care at all for those medical conditions? Did you obtain,' said, 'Yes or no?'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then it's so 'Was the medical response timely?' 'Yes or no?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Next major question, 'Do you have any dental needs?' So medical then dental? Dental needs, you answer 'Yes or no?' 'If so, have you requested care?'

Pfc. Manning

I don't believe that-- I believe that was added later. I [missed a few words] question. I don't believe that-- because I requested for medical, but I requested for dental, cause I-- at some point there wasn't-- that they didn't have-- they didn't ask that particular question.

Prosecution (Fein)

[Missed. Perhaps, 'One moment' but not certain]. Before we keep going, just frame of reference, do you remember receiving any of these form before 19 August, cause the first form I have is 19 August 2010?

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

It was-- it was-- early August so the-- so it would have been the 3rd of August for the very first time, I believe, sir. I'm guessing-- I'm guessing-- I'm just guessing--

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure--

Pfc. Manning

--I'm not gonna [missed a few word], but within first ten days that I was there.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so. And, then they-- the command used at this point, you said earlier, some variant of this form through even when they visit today, and at Fort Leavenworth or a local facility that you might be housed at?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Your Honor, for purpose, you could probably can see that right now, the form.

There are no, at least here, forms before 19 August.

[to witness]

Okay, so after dental needs the next [missed] question is, 'Have you been visited by your unit?' which also might seem odd, since they are asking you, and they are the unit?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean that form was for-- it wasn't necessarily just specifically for me, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, it says 'Have you been visited by your unit? Yes or no?' and then it even asks, 'Who had visited you in the past?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, then 'When was that last visit?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. [Missed small bit]. United States Army Garrison as well, sir. I believe. It's always the same or continuous for-- for me.

But, for other soldiers in confinement that have some other things that there...there broad [width?] questions and there broad [width?] answers. [Missed last statement], sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. I think even one time you had someone do it who was not the XO [Executive Officer] Commander or First Sergeant. I think Chief [Wigman?]?

Pfc. Manning

I-- something alone those lines, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Then next major question, 'Had you been visited by a chaplain?' like we talked about earlier?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you answer, 'Yes or no?'

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Who visited you? When was the last time they visited?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, well, other next major question, 'Are you putting your uniforms and other clothing out for cleaning?' So, they are making sure that you are at least getting your uniforms cleaned?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then a series of questions about when that happened or when you would get them back?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Then the next question-- major question, is about getting-- having showers? 'Are you allowed to shower?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, with that, 'You have soap, shaving gear, and a towel?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And sometimes the answers were, 'No,' and you asked them for help with that?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Next major question, 'Are you being offered recreation time each day?' And then--

Pfc. Manning

--'any issues with that?'

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, then 'How long?' They would ask how long you do rec call for?

Pfc. Manning

And how often, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Next question, 'Do you have telephone access?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, then, 'Have you made any calls?'

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, 'How many calls have you made?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, these aren't just 'Yes or no?' questions, some of them elicited actual responses?

Pfc. Manning

[Missed answer but affirmative].

Prosecution (Fein)

And then questions making sure you had adequate access to your defense attorney? Do you have telephone-- so, specifically 'Do you have telephonic access to your defense attorney?'

Pfc. Manning

Certainly. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Has your defense attorney visited you here?' So, they are asking about physical visitation?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And they had, 'Have you visited your defense attorney?' as well? Why-- why-- what is the difference there?

Pfc. Manning

Well, just in case I have to go someplace, to a TDS [Trial Defense Service] office that might normally be on post, or something like that. But, again the form is designed for more broad [missed word], not necessarily just me, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, did you ever visit with your defense counsel outside of Quantico Brig, while you were confined there?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. We met at a few times at Fort Meyer.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, your chain of command would go sign you out of Quantico and bring you to Fort Meyer, Virginia?

Pfc. Manning

Military District of Washington would sometimes.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

I don't have-- it was the Army. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, someone in the Army, like on behalf of the commander would show up and then bring you to the TDS office?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

What about-- since we already talked about it-- what about medical appointments and dental appointments? How did those...explain to the Court how those worked, please?

Pfc. Manning

Medical and dental appointments from-- as far as the Brig and the [missed word] at Quantico base were concerned, were not their issue.

They considered those to be the unit's responsibility, and so accordingly I would make those requests to my command-- my Army command.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, when you made that request, they would then-- the Army command would show up and-- and take you to those appointments?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But the Brig did have a corpsmen, a medic on staff, that would visit?

Pfc. Manning

Not the Brig. The Quantico base-- the Quantico base sort of had an Officer Candidate School that was nearby, in which the corpsmen would travel over occasionally, if there was an emergency or something-- like an issue.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Okay. Now looking at what is typically page two, then the next major question is, 'Do you have access to the Brig library?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Yes or no?' questions, 'If yes, are you reading material offered to you at your cell?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Then, the next one now starts talking about chow. So, 'Are you being fed everyday?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Next question and then, '[Missed]...'

Pfc. Manning

--'Hot meals?'

Prosecution (Fein)

--'[missed]?' Wait, I'm sorry, 'How many?'...

Pfc. Manning

--'How many meals?'

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, 'How many meals?'

Pfc. Manning

'Whether they are hot ones?'

Prosecution (Fein)

And, that's the next question. 'Whether they are hot?' So, you even remember today, these questions?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The next big question, almost like the case here, 'Have you had any visitors other than the chain of command?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, they were concerned whether you were getting visitors?

Pfc. Manning

Are, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

They are concerned with visits, still today.

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. And then they would ask, 'So, who?' and you would tell them.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, then they would ask when was the last visit?

Pfc. Manning

Sir, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, if there was any issues surrounding their visit?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The next major question is, 'If the inmate is on suicide watch or injury prevention?' and then the first question cause that is the topic, 'How long have you been on suicide watch or injury prevention?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The next question is, 'Do you understand why you are on suicide watch or prevention-- injury prevention?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'When was the last time you saw a doctor, therapist, or counselor?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Pfc. Manning

'If so what was the visit--' or 'Was that visit on post or at the Brig?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Next major question, 'Are you getting any prescription medications that you need?'--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Yes of no?' 'Did you get them in doses prescribed?' That was the next question?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, 'Did you get the medication on time?' To make sure you are actually getting what you are suppose to get what you are suppose to get from the Brig?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And that is a 'Yes or no?' question?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The next question is-- or still is today-- was and, 'Since my or the command's last visit, how have you been treated by the guards?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then the question following that, 'Since my or the command's last visit, how have you been treated by the facility?'

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The next question, 'Do you understand the inmate grievance process or [missed word] procedure?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, some specific questions about that every single time? So, I assume once you answered the first time, a lot of these were the same?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir. Sometimes-- sometimes they would not be asked [missed two words].

Prosecution (Fein)

These-- this portion?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, they would-- if they-- I mean like-- my command would eventually start to just skip questions that-- if they were not necessary, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, when you say that, I assume you mean like 'Did you receive an inmate [missed word]?'

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir. We would go-- skip over that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Because, once you said 'Yes,' probably in August of 2010, you didn't need to say it again [missed last bit].

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, the very last question is, 'Do you have any needs that we the command can take care of?'

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, then bottom left, you would print, sign, date? And, then the visitor on the bottom right would print, sign, date?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then also, there was a-- was a-- was it a DoD or [DA?] form? There was the consignment facility form. I don't know what type of form that the command rep had to sign, if there was any issues to get to the Brig, and then you would sign too?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Normally that was a-- there is a [missed a few words] form. I would sign it, but it would be the representative that would fill it out in terms of the written part. I was in restraints, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And this was done in a visitation booth area?

Pfc. Manning

A non-contact booth, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, now, what I would like to do is...is just go through some of these, and just ask you some very specific questions.

So, as far your 19 August 2010-- the first documented command visit we have, when you were asked about, 'How have you been treated by the guards?' Your answer was, 'Very professional'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then about the facility, 'Very professional'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, 'Have we taken care of all your needs?' You of course wrote, 'Not sure, yet' or said, 'You're not sure yet'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

That's because it was the first visit, and they didn't have an opportunity to take care of any needs?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. I was not-- I'm not-- I don't recall the reason why. They-- if it was-- if it was obvious.

I think that there were-- there were various issues in terms of moving, logistics-- the logistics involved in-- where certain items were, including my shoes, and things like that, and paperwork, being transferred [missed a few words] from Fort Drum, and-- and my LES [Leave and Earning Statement] and things like that [missed word].

A lot of just basic soldier issues, dealing with a permanent change of station [missed a few words].

Prosecution (Fein)

Now, looking at the next document 26 August 2010 they visited you, then asked about 'Do you have telephone access?' 'Yes,' 'for attorney?' 'How many calls have you made?' You actually said, 'zero,' at that point. And then, you were asked about treatment by the guards. You wrote or you said, 'Very professionally'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'By the facility?' 'Very professionally' and you wrote, 'No issues'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. The person asking the questions wrote that portion.

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. Lt. [Barnard?]. And then, 'Is there anything we could take care of?' You actually [missed a few words] you wrote, 'Disposition of no [missed word] needs'

Pfc. Manning

[Missed].

Prosecution (Fein)

This is the tennis shoes, more that likely?

Pfc. Manning

More broadly, it was-- I have a lot-- I had a lot of stuff, I know or recall whether it was in Government storage or whatever.

I had friends that had stuff. I had a lot of CIF, so Central Issue Facility, for like equipment that was all over the place, so I wanted to make sure that it was all accounted for and that I wouldn't have to end up paying for it, you know-- you know-- plate gear and armor or plate carriers and things like that.

So, that way I knew where it was and that the Army knew where it was, so [missed a few words]. So, I wouldn't have to have that docked-- docked from my pay, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure. And, they took care of that for you?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, now going to the next documented check list in 10 September 2010, when asked about the guards, still 'Professional'?

Pfc. Manning

Very professional, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And the facility is still, 'professional'?

Pfc. Manning

Very professional, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Do you have any needs that could be taken care of?' You say, 'No'?

Pfc. Manning

They-- they wrote down that.

Prosecution (Fein)

They wrote down that?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. And I signed the document.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, did have [missed word] needs, or?

Pfc. Manning

[Missed a few words]-- there was a decision made either by [missed a few words]. You know, I am not privy to how the command thinks through that--

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure.

Pfc. Manning

--I am not going to question Captain [Barnard?], Captain Casamatta, or First Sergeant William, but they would-- they would make a decision as to whether-- I would always vocally, you know, explain something, but sometimes they would-- I mean they would write down, 'No issues,' and-- as opposed to, you know-- but that didn't necessarily mean that I didn't bring anything up, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, I guess on 10 September, are you saying, you did bring something up or that there were no issues?

Pfc. Manning

On 10 September?

Prosecution (Fein)

On 10 September--

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall, but there were often times where I would vocally-- and sometimes it would just be dealt with at that level, and it didn't-- like no issues would be for-- like if it was an issue that needed to be dealt with and that needed to be written down, and couldn't be dealt with right there verbally-- then-- then it would be written down.

But, normally-- normally if there was an issue that-- like dental and [missed word] transported, belongings and things like that-- to remind, you know, First Sergeant Williams or Captain Casamatta, they would write it down, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so they could-- whatever command rep showed up-- your-- the First Sergeant, XO, First Sergeant, Company Command official-- if they could [missed a few words] right there with you, then it was like, 'Okay. Write it down'--

Pfc. Manning

--right. If they could remember it then they would just usually put down, 'No issues.'

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. On 17 September, I just realized that we just talked about 10 September, so one week later 17 September-- again asked about the guards and the facility, this time it was, 'Professionally' the way that they were treating you?

Pfc. Manning

Very professionally.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Do you have any issues or needs?' Excuse me, not 'issues.' I know I said that before, 'needs that need to be taken care of?' Answer was, 'No'?

Pfc. Manning

That was-- that's what is on there. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now three days later, they came back on 23 September-- I am assuming this date is correct, and again your answer about the guards and the facility is, 'Professional'--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--the way that you think that you are being treated?

Pfc. Manning

I would hope it would say, 'Very professional.'

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so this time, they wrote just, 'Professional'?

Pfc. Manning

Right. They stopped putting the 'very' in the sentence, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

And, then again, 'Do you have any needs we need to be taken care of?' "No.' And, then you signed the bottom left?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

On 30 September, through this I just notice one difference here, 'Are you being offered recreation time?' You say...'Yes or no?' isn't checked, but what is hand written is, 'if it is not raining, 20 minutes'?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And now going back, on 30 September, to the guards and the facility this time it says, 'Excellent,' and then, 'Very professional'? So, guards were 'Excellent'? And then the facility, 'Very professional'?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall, but-- I mean, that is why I usually say-- I'm usually, you know-- just say either-- I would start-- started to vocally give a rating.

So, in terms of whether it was excellent performance or, you know-- and then 'very'-- the facility, 'very professionally.'

I mean-- so, that's what-- how I vocally did it. You know, just-- just repeated the same thing most of the time, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And-- and-- and, I have mentioned this before, but 'Do you understand the grievance procedures?' 'Yes'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

7 October 2010. Same questions. 'Treated by the guards?' This time it actually says, 'Fine.' 'Treated by facility?' Same, 'Fine.' So, is this part of the grading process--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--at this point?

Pfc. Manning

I mean, that's-- that's how I sort of saw it was, you know, fine, excellent. I mean-- I just used-- I mean, I used a buzz word.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

And vocally to [missed word]. I mean I'm not the one-- again, I'm not the one-- I'm not the one that is writing these--

Prosecution (Fein)

--sure.

Pfc. Manning

--these answers down. But, I would sign the document again, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And then here, 'Do you have any needs we can take care of?' "No.' And then actually this-- this-- this week, they wrote, 'Not at this time'? At least, was said in the documenting?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

15 October 2010. This one appeared to be a little different. 'Are you getting rec call?' The answer is, 'Yes.' 'How long each day?' Again, you say, '20 minutes'...

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--at this point. 'How are you being treated by the guards?' 'Very professional.' 'How are you being treated by the facility?' 'Very professionally.' So, at least this portion appear to be the same...

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--[missed last part of his statement question]. Now on 21 October 2010, you were asked about the guards. 'Professional.' You're asked about the treating facility and how they're treating you. 'Professionally'--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--'Any needs to take care of?' 'No.' [Missed a few words], on 27 October 2010, you were asked, 'Have you been visited by a chaplain?' You answered, 'Yes.' And, then you said, 'Who visited you?' and it was 'Chaplain Rosenball [sp.]. Is that what you [missed word] before?

Pfc. Manning

It might be the right name. I am not sure.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

--I was not sure, and I stated that, whenever. I wasn't sure how to pronounce it. I wasn't sure if it was the correct name. I wasn't even sure if it was the correct rank. Cause I wasn't sure what branch of service.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Well, it would sort of-- it makes sense. Chaplain could be any branch or any rank.

Pfc. Manning

Okay, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'When's your last attorney visit?' 'Two weeks ago.' So, this one actually is slightly different, because it says, 'Since my visit-- since my last visit, how have you been treated by the guards?' This time, 'Excellent. Very professional.' And then, about the facility, 'Excellent. Very professional,' as well.

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I-- I previously stated the same thing for that part.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

So, me vocally-- me verbally it would be the same every time, but they would write it down differently.

Prosecution (Fein)

Oh. Okay. [Missed a few words, I think, 'I get it,' but not certain]. 10 November, is that your recollection, the same?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--about the guards? Whether you had needs to be taken care of? [Long pause] 'Do you have telephone access?' Here's a difference. You remember saying, 'No,' because the phone was down that week?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Guards, facility?' Essentially the same answers, 'Alright' 'No issues.' Actually that is a little different, because on 17-- or, excuse me, 18 November when asked, 'How have you been treated by the guards?' This time, at least what they wrote down was, 'Alright. No issues.' So, not just the 'Professional.' "Very professional.' 'Fine.' This one is 'Alright. No issues.'

Pfc. Manning

Correct. That was what was written down, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

That is what you said, or that what was written down?

Pfc. Manning

Probably what I said. I switched from 'excellent' to 'okay', 'alright'.

Judge Lind

Major Fein, can I talk to you for a second.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am.

Judge Lind

I am a little confused. I followed the Court's copy of what was as the attachment, and I end at-- with these notes at 15 October. Should there be more of them?

Prosecution (Fein)

I think that might have been a printing issue, your Honor. But, we have copies right here. We'll just [get?] a fresh copy for you. If that will--?

Judge Lind

Can you send someone out to make one, so I can just go along with you when you are asking your questions?

Prosecution (Fein)

I'm sorry, could you say that--?

Judge Lind

Could you send someone out to make a copy of these?

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, I have [one?] here.

Judge Lind

Thank you.

Prosecution (Fein)

I [will?] also have them marked as well. Ma'am this has been marked as appellate exhibit 426(b).

Judge Lind

Thank you.

Prosecution (Fein)

Ma'am 18 November 2010, bottom right of the page would say 700-- page 755 of 1,505.

[to witness]

Private First Class Manning, on 18 November 2010, we left off with, you had said already, 'No issues,' about the treatment by the guards or [missed a few words]?

Pfc. Manning

Towards the middle of autumn, I think-- I think I changed my statement back then to something along the lines [missed a few words] they were 'average', 'alright', sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then actually this one, you did have something that they could take care of-- and 'One [missed word] set of sweats, small'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

What do you mean by that?

Pfc. Manning

I did-- I did not have-- it was getting cold in there. And, I did not have-- although, most of the-- most of the detainees at that facility from what I understand, had been-- they were issued sweats.

The Marine Corps still had sweats. But, [missed full statement.]. So, I did not have sweats to stay warm. [Missed word], the facility [missed statement].

Prosecution (Fein)

So what did the command do, based off that request?

Pfc. Manning

They went out and got at Target, sweats.

Prosecution (Fein)

Ah, okay. Cause the Army doesn't have sweats, anymore [missed last word].

Pfc. Manning

Right.

Prosecution (Fein)

Did you receive those sweats?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. They were dark grey generic sweats.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now the next date on 28, excuse me, 26 November 2010, First Sergeant Williams visited you? To the best of your knowledge, this was the-- is this the first date that he forgot the checklist?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

It's not or is?

Pfc. Manning

It's not.

Prosecution (Fein)

When do you remember him, not having the check list before?

Pfc. Manning

It was-- it was-- First Sergeant Williams actually was-- would frequently forget it.

So, it was not-- it was not uncommon for him to not-- and sometimes he would not write anything down.

He would just come of see me, and ask the questions, and not necessarily put it in to a document, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, sometimes he would-- so sometimes he would have the document.

Sometimes he didn't have the document, but would write stuff down, and as you are saying, sometimes he wouldn't write anything down, and you would have a conversation with him?

Pfc. Manning

First Sergeant-- First Sergeant Williams. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So on this date of 26 November 2010, when asked about how you were getting treated? 'Professional'?

Pfc. Manning

We had these questions memorized all the time, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. We or you?

Pfc. Manning

We.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so he did to?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, still probably today?

Pfc. Manning

Absolutely.

Prosecution (Fein)

10 December 2010, this time it sounds the same. 'How have you been treated by the guards?' 'Excellent.' 'Since your last visit...since the command's last visit, how is the facility treating you?' 'Excellent.' And you signed this document as well?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And actually here, 'Do you have any needs to be taken care of?' You wrote, 'Need underwear and T-shirts'?

Pfc. Manning

I don't know if I wrote that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, but at least stated, you needed underwear and T-shirts?

Pfc. Manning

I did need more underwear and T-shirts. I had-- the one's I had were from my deployment, as so they stilled smelled-- they still smelled like Iraq.

Prosecution (Fein)

[laughs] So, you need new ones?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, they were able to obtain those for you?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now--

Pfc. Manning

No matter how many times it got washed, it [missed], sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. On 14 December 2010, there is a change here. 'Are you being offered rec time?' You say your answer was, 'Yes.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But then, here is says, 'How long each day?' But here you stated, 'One hour a day.'

Pfc. Manning

I had notified them of the change, the increase that Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart had made.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, at this point, he had increased the rec time, and then--

Pfc. Manning

--and, notified me of that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

When asked about how treated by the guards, this time, at least they wrote down, 'Good. Excellent.' And then, somebody put , 'Excellent,' do you remember?

Pfc. Manning

Again, it goes back to [missed two words], sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, are there any needs to be taken care of, your answer was, 'No'. 23 December--

Pfc. Manning

Not-- not-- not necessarily, sir. I mean I would-- I would vocalize concerns, but they might be dealt with vocally, as opposed to having to be written down, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. What you said a couple minutes ago?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I mean-- I'm just setting on the record.

Prosecution (Fein)

Good. On 23 December, so this is two days before Christmas, they showed up to visit you?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

23 December 2010, when asked about you were being treated by the guards, this time at least it was written down, 'Fine.' 'Treated by the facility?' "Fine.' Do you remember that?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, 'Do you have any needs to be taken care of this time?' Now this-- this month if you remember there was no, 'Yes or no?' but it was written in there, 'Not at this time.'

Pfc. Manning

I would always-- almost every single time, because if I didn't have anything, I would-- I would usually state, 'Well, not at this time,' just to be careful, because-- I mean there might not be issues today at this moment. But, I might have issues in a week, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And you signed and dated that one. Now, 30 December 2010, so they came, I guess, one week later-- again asked, 'Treated by the guards?' 'Excellent.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Treated by the facility?' 'Excellent.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Any needs to be taken care of?' This time just, 'No,' signed, dated. Next date, on 6 January 2011, 'How have you been treated by the guards?' 'Excellent.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Treated by the facility?' Oddly here, 'Treated by the facility?' at least what was written down was, 'No issues,' for, 'How are you being treated by the facility?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. That's what is says. What was the date on that, sir?

Prosecution (Fein)

6 January 2011.

Pfc. Manning

That was whenever I started raising the 5-10 issue or I had verbally-- vocally to Captain-- was it Captain Casamatta?

Prosecution (Fein)

It was.

Pfc. Manning

--and I vocally explained that, but he didn't write it. He didn't put it down, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

I was-- I told him, that I was going to submit a 5-10 the next day.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. On 14 January 2011, the one where you were initialing items around, you were asked-- or again, on 14 January 2011, you were asked, 'How were you being treated by the guards?' 'Excellent.' 'Treated by the facility?' again 'Excellent.' At this point, 'Do you understand the grievance procedure?' You-- like every month, you answered, "Yes.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Now, what is the date on this one, sir?

Prosecution (Fein)

14 January 2011.

Pfc. Manning

Okay, so that-- is that the--

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, this one--

Pfc. Manning

I think-- I think that they might be wrong on that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, it's interesting that you say that, and would you like a copy to look at?

Pfc. Manning

I-- if you don't mind.

Prosecution (Fein)

I don't. [Missed a few words] hand the witness, what had been marked as appellate exhibit 426(d). It's the whole packet. [Missed a few words] dated November the bottom packet. Page 771 of 1,505. Starts at page [missed].

Pfc. Manning

771 of 1,505?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes.

Pfc. Manning

And that's where it starts?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes. So, it's the next two pages.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, on the top left, you initialed a change in the date?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I did not. The-- Captain Casamatta-- no, First Sergeant Williams did.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Got it. Cause that's a 'BW', not--

Pfc. Manning

I remember that-- I remember that-- I remember that there was a-- that we weren't sure what day it was. Neither of us were, and we asked the Brig staff. They weren't sure either, so.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, it wasn't 14 January?

Pfc. Manning

We never got an answer.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, well it was initialed by First Sergeant Williams.

Pfc. Manning

Well, I'm guessing-- my best guess is that it was-- that it-- that it was the 14th of--

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

He might have checked that out before he answered.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, it-- it definitely is changed from what was originally there, and then initialed after the change, correct?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir, because that-- those are not my initials for the change on the 14, yes--

Prosecution (Fein)

Cause it's not 'BEM' versus it says 'BW'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So if you look now on the next page, 772.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, just starting from the top down--

Pfc. Manning

And, again those are not my initials where the-- where is says--

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure.

Pfc. Manning

--where I put the date in-- that is not my initials.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, the initials on the top left and the bottom left of page 772 is the same initials that are the top left of 771?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. So, the middle of the page, the question, 'Since my last visit, how have you been treated by the guards?' Your answer was 'Excellent.' 'How have you been treated by the facility?' At least what was written was 'Alright'?

Pfc. Manning

I did not write that. First Sergeant Williams did.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, 'Do you understand the grievance process?' The answer was, 'Yes.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But there is a difference here, and it says, 'Have you used it?' You say this time is 'Yes.' And, 'What for?' And, you told your First Sergeant, 'To figure out how to get off injury prevention.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then you stated-- or on here it says, 'Friday 7 Jan' on it?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I-- I again notified the fact that I was putting a-- I was supplementing the fact that I had notified the previous-- the previous one that I had stated, 'I am putting a 5-10 through the facility-- to the facility commander,' and then I-- because I was worried that my 5-10's were not making it where they needed to go, because the fact they [missed word] them in late December.

So, I got the-- I made sure I was covered my bases on that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, but I guess what I am confused about Private First Class Manning is the December and the January documents-- and feel free to flip back about two or three...

Pfc. Manning

Certainly, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

When it is asked, 'Have you used the grievance procedure?' You always answer, 'No.'

Pfc. Manning

Well I-- sometimes we would skip over that [missed a few words], because we just didn't need to go over that question, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, but on this date, the answer is, 'Yes'? So, going back to 14, well what has been-- what First Sergeant Williams changed and initialed 14 January?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

This date, the answer is 'Yes,' you have used procedures? And, then--

Pfc. Manning

Yes and for that specific 5-10.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, that is what you meant went you told him, and he wrote this down?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, thank you. And then you signed the bottom left?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Private First Class Manning, do you need a comfort break right now or we could go a few more minutes?

Pfc. Manning

Seven more minutes would be good.

Prosecution (Fein)

Seven more? [laughs] Seven more it will be.

Pfc. Manning

I think I can deal with that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. I'll try to get it within seven minutes. [laugh]So on-- so the next date-- if you look in the packet it's page 774 or the appellate exhibit. This one dated in the bottom right where you-- is that [missed a few word] initials in the bottom right? The 'BEM'?

Pfc. Manning

For that, 771?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes-- No. 774. Onto the next page. This is the handwritten document--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, those are.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, those are your initials 20 January 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I didn't put a slash through the zero, but--

Prosecution (Fein)

Got it. On the 20, you are talking about?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And if you look to the middle of the page, number 12, it says, 'How have you been treated by the guards?' This time you wrote, 'Decent.' For number 16, 'Any other needs?' You wrote, 'Nothing new,' this time. Now is the reason you wrote 'Nothing new,' is, because you still are trying to ask about 'Why and how it was implemented,' meaning POI?

Pfc. Manning

Well the 'Nothing new,' it goes from 16 then it goes to 17, that is to same one.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, 16 'Nothing new,' any other needs, 'Nothing new.' 17, 'Some grievance pending,' which is what is referencing, 'Nothing new,' that is what you talked about the week before?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then you starred here, 'Why and how it was implemented'?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, this is your handwriting on this document?

Pfc. Manning

For the 'Manning, ' just the name. I did not put the asterisks or the 'Why and how it was implemented.'

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, thank you. Now, going to 29 January 2011, feel free to flip if you need to. Going to the second page, when asked on 28 January 2011, 'Since my last visit, how have you been treated by the guards?' you wrote, 'Better,' or you stated, 'Better,' excuse me. You didn't write it.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Because, there was a-- because there was an incident on the 18th involving-- involving two of the guards.

So, we went over that, and I explained that-- that it was better-- that the-- the-- that incident had occurred.

I had explained that in the previous week, or the previous one. I just explained that it was better, because of-- there were-- there were no incident between that time and this visit, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. No, but-- so, you just said that you spoke to them the week before, the previous week, now that was on 20 January, but when asked about 'How you were treated by the guards?' Is that why you just said, 'Decent'? Because you had the incident on the 18th?

Pfc. Manning

Right. It's a lower rating than, 'Excellent.'

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. It's a grading process?

Pfc. Manning

Right, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Also on 28 January, when asked, 'If your needs are being taken care of?' I guess you had a request of three pairs of socks and 'You had more when you got there, but you need more.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. My-- the number of socks I had, started to diminish--

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

--in the time frame. I don't know why, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And they were able to get you more socks?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

It's a little bit before seven minutes, but, your Honor, United States moves for a 15 minute recess.

Judge Lind

Alright, any objection?

Defense (Coombs)

No, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Alright, Court is in recess for twenty minutes [missed word].

ALL RISE

Judge Lind

Please be seated. This Article 39(a) Session is called to order. Let the record reflect all parties present when the Court last recessed are again present in Court. Major Fein.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am. Private First Class Manning, just remind you, you are still under oath.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Private First Class Manning, when we left off we were going through the weekly updates from the chain of command, I think we stopped at 4 February 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Do you know which page that was?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes. Page-- on the bottom right corner page 779.

Pfc. Manning

779. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And this is appellate exhibit 426(b). So during this visit on 4 February 2011, when asked about how the guards-- how you were being treated by the guards, you answered, 'Very well,' or words to that effect?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, 'How you were treated by the facility?' 'Excellent,' or words to that effect?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Understood the grievance procedures?' You-- you acknowledged, 'Yes,' at this point to?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And had no real comments about whether you had any needs to be taken care of?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. Going to the-- the next week, 11 February 2011.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The second page, when asked well at least here, when asked, 'Since the last visit, have you have been treated by the guards here?' was just, 'Yes,' not a, 'No,' and no real comment, at least, documented on this week, correct?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. There was an unusual-- we had a-- there was a different-- it says here Sergeant First Class Jones did this. So, it was done differently, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, the following week, 18 February 2011, I assume this was another week that First Sergeant Williams did not have the form with him?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And on this 18 February 2011, towards the bottom, with the question of, 'Do you have any visitation concerns?' written differently, the answer was, 'No'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'Was there anything he could help you with?' You actually did ask for some help from your chain of command here. I think you wrote, 'Your head gear possible beret, size seven'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I was being transferred using a pc [patrol cap], while everybody else was in berets. For movement, and that was just a minor issue.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, you needed to get an actual beret to start wearing?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. That was before the pc became the utility uniform--

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

--covered utility.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, and then what type of movement, cause I assume this is outside of the Brig?

Pfc. Manning

Correct. For attorney visits, and I think we had a 706 board.

Prosecution (Fein)

Around this time in February?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then you also asked for a dentist for the following-- following the last visit?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I still had some work that needed to be done.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then why ask First Sergeant about checking on a magazine order that you did in your name?

Pfc. Manning

Because I started receiving magazine bills at Quantico Base Brig. It was-- they were concerned about the fact that I was getting bills, while I was in confinement. So, I brought to the attention of the command as well, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And what happened for that, when you brought that to their attention?

Pfc. Manning

Nothing really ever came up. It never affected my credit rating or anything. So, it got reported.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, thank you. So, 25 February 2011, the next visit.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

When asked how you were being treated by the guards, you said, 'Very professionally.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'How's the facility treating you?' you said, 'Very professionally.' 'Any needs that can be taken care of?' 'No,' at least that is what is marked here, and you signed?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. On 2 March 2011...

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--similarly, 'Since your last visit, how have you been treated by the guards?' 'Alright,' this was how it was documented?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, 'About then facility?' This time, actually it was, 'Okay'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, 'Do you have any needs that could be taken care of?' 'No,' and at least this time documented by First Sergeant Williams and you, it says, 'Not at this time'?

Pfc. Manning

That's correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Private First Class Manning, on 11 March is the next visit that was documented. On here, when it talks about the rec time, 'How long each day?' 'One hour,' was written?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And also up top, about the chaplain visit. Now it says, 'First Lieutenant' I think 'Rosenfald' [sp.]..

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir--

Prosecution (Fein)

--was the chaplain?

Pfc. Manning

That is not correct. I recall now he is a [missed word]. He was an Navy Lieutenant, so.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, Navy Lieutenant, which is a Army--

Pfc. Manning

--Captain.

Prosecution (Fein)

--Captain. Thank you. And then at the same visit, 'How were you treated by the guards?' It was annotated, 'Very well.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And by the facility, 'Very well'?

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, no needs to be taken care of yet?

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

Exactly one week later, on 18 March 2011, when asked about the treatment of the guards, this time, 'Very professional,' and the facility, you said, 'Maybe overcautious'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And what did you mean by, 'Maybe over cautious'?

Pfc. Manning

This is-- is 18 March, so I was concerned because Chief Warrant Officer Two Barnes had placed me on what I considered some kind of suicide restriction, but without it being called a suicide restriction, so I discussed this with First Sergeant Williams.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. At that point did you ask him to-- to figure it out-- to help you with it?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, then, 'Do you have any needs to be taken care of?' The answer is, 'No'?

Pfc. Manning

'Do you have any other needs?' is the way he always asked the question verbally.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then the answer then, "any other needs?' was, 'No,' also?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Thank you. The next-- the next week was 23-- or the next visit and document 23 March 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, 'How were you were treated by the guards?' "Very well,' was written down on the document?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, 'How were you treated by the facility?' Again slightly different, it says, 'Treated okay, but communication issues.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I relayed the same information to Captain Casamatta that I did with First Sergeant Williams in the...I think it was two prior...it might have been one prior--

Prosecution (Fein)

And a--

Pfc. Manning

--[missed a few words] March.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, what did you mean by 'communication issues'?

Pfc. Manning

That is what he wrote down. I described the same thing as I did with First Sergeant Williams, and just described it, but to the Company Commander, not just the First Sergeant.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so the term 'communication issues' was Captain Casamatta's...

Pfc. Manning

Right.

Prosecution (Fein)

--choice of words?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Did you agree with this, when you signed it?

Pfc. Manning

Well, yes. It's signed [missed word].

Prosecution (Fein)

And, 'Any other needs?' You said, 'Not right now'?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The next visitation on 31 March 2011?

Pfc. Manning

[Made affirmative sound like 'mm-hmm'.] Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

'How were you treated by the guards?' now is, 'Alright.' This one says, 'Treated by the facility?' 'Okay.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, any needs to be taken care of, the box of 'No,' is checked?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Go to the next month...was there another one...another visitation that was documented after...that you're aware of after 31 March 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Another visitation?

Prosecution (Fein)

By your chain of command, correct.

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Yes, sir. There was.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, when was that?

Pfc. Manning

I don't know.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

I mean there were-- there were April visitations. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And when did you-- when did you leave Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

I left Quantico Base Brig on 20 April of 2011, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, these check lists continued once you went to the JRCF?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

I would like to look at very quickly the next one in the...in front of you, which is dated 28 July 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, this form is-- is actually I think it's the exact same form, because even the top says Marine Corps Base Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. They fixed it at [missed a few words].

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Now-- got it. On page two, 'How have you ben treated by the guards?' 'Great. No issues,' is what was documented by Captain Casamatta?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I upgraded to 'Great,' because it was really, really good, sir. It's above excellent.

Prosecution (Fein)

Makes sense. And, 'Treated by the facility?' 'Same as everyone else.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I was treated equally as other detainees or other inmates. So I felt that I was now being treated as normal, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, you signed this one as well?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You honor, I am retrieving what has been marked as appellate exhibit 426 Bravo.

So, at least when you met with the chain of command, and your Army chain of command came to visit, and you had issues, they worked to resolve those issues for you?

Pfc. Manning

Absolutely. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You needed shoes. They [missed word] even your Fort Drum shoes.

Pfc. Manning

Yes. At the company-- at the company level in particular it was outstanding, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And if it required interaction with the Brig, your-- your request [missed word]-- they were able to interact with the Brig, and it was all no issues?

Pfc. Manning

I'm-- I don't know. I mean sometimes, yes; sometimes, no. I-- I wasn't privy to the conversations between the Army-- at the company level and the Brig at the Brigade level. I don't know. I don't know how those interactions went, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

That's fair. But, at least for the company commander at the company level or the First Sergeant, or one time Sergeant First Class Jones showing up, when you had issues that you shared with them, they at there level, would either resolve them if they could on the spot, as you talked about--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--or they would get back to you, based off what you asked them to do?

Pfc. Manning

Sometimes-- sometimes they would just forget what the issue was.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. But, none of those reports we just looked at reference prior-- well I think one report references prior issue, but then after they got resolved, then everything was still back to, sort of the norm?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, between the chits that you're filing with DD 5-10's with the Brig--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--and your request from assistance from your chain of command, when those were submitted either the Brig and your chain of command answered them?

Pfc. Manning

Normally, yes. For minor administrative things or, you know, clothing issues, the magazines, books, those issues they were normally-- that was-- if not-- if not rapidly, then within a decent amount of time to.

Prosecution (Fein)

But-- but in none of these requests, you never asked the chain of command, you never asked the chain of command to assist you in changing your POI status, or you did?

Pfc. Manning

I did, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You did. That never then-- never got resolved.

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, then it was never documented each time, each week?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, because it-- whenever we got to the question-- because on every single one there is a question regarding the POI status-- the SR status-- normally if we were going through the questions, sometimes we would stop at that one, you know, 'Are you still on POI?'-- you know, 'Are you still working through your counsel et cetera?'

They would-- we would talk about, where that process was and everything else, so. That was-- that was the time, whenever we would normally discuss it, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, during those discussions you were never-- you never reached out to them and say, 'Listen, can y'all help with whatever it takes to get me off of this status?'

Pfc. Manning

I did do that, sir, yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

You did?

Pfc. Manning

I did do that, sir. Within-- I don't recall how early it was, but, you know, I did talk to Captain Casamatta frequently about it, because he was very concerned about the fact that I was on-- on a restrictive status.

Captain Casamatta in particular would always ask me about that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Ask you about it, but-- I guess where I'm-- but, I do understand-- and I am just trying to understand, and what most people wouldn't understand is-- he was concerned about-- y'all have discussions about POI status?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

I mean it is clear from the check list that 'prevention of injury' was actually written in on the right side--

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--and you'd have discussions about that?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, at what point were you reaching out to the chain of command that was visiting you each week to say, 'It needs to be changed. I am not suicidal'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. That's-- that's the gist of the discussion right there, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But it wasn't documented?

Pfc. Manning

Well, we checked-- I mean we checked in the box-- I mean, well we once a week-- they had-- there was a lot of other things going on, and we assumed-- we also assumed that our conversations were being recorded as well, so we thought, you know, check the box, you know and I thought--

I mean, I don't know how-- I don't know how Captain Casamatta and First Sergeant Williams documented the other-- the other stuff, but the form-- I mean, we just went through the form to make sure that all-- that all bases were covered every single time, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, but it wasn't a pencil [missed a few words]? And it's just-- I'm sorry. It wasn't that you sat down with Captain Casamatta or First Sergeant Williams, and simply just went through real quick and checked everything?

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you still went through the questions?

Pfc. Manning

Every single one, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You had an opportunity to document whatever it is you needed to do, whatever you wanted to make sure was documented, and then you signed the form, but never reaching out and saying that--

Pfc. Manning

Well, it's a check list, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, it is except for there are certain areas, like at the bottom of what else-- what else do you needs from the chain of command, where it was written down all the time?

Pfc. Manning

Well, issues that-- issues that-- to remind Captain Casamatta or First Sergeant Williams, you know-- if there was something that was being brought up that we couldn't resolve on the spot, like-- like I said, or that we hadn't covered before, then-- then [missed a few words], sir. [Missed a statement].

Prosecution (Fein)

Are you aware that when-- when in the January time frame after you submitted the chit to the Brig, and you then you talked to Captain Casamatta, and Captain Casamatta then went to the Brig officials--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--after you requested it?

Pfc. Manning

Absolutely. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So he went to the Brig officials to say, 'Explain the POI issue to me'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, that happened in January 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, it was documented on the form?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you are saying today at least that, that also happened all before January 2011?

Pfc. Manning

I don't know. I did talk to Captain Casamatta-- again, I don't-- I'm not privy to, you know, communications of, you know, Captain Casamatta and the Brig, sir.

I assumed that whenever I bring it up-- I assumed that whenever I brought up the issue with Captain Casamatta, he was going to see what he could do.

I mean there wasn't a lot that he could do about it-- he doesn't work at the Brig, you know. He is not an officer there. So, he is only looking out for me from the unit's standpoint in that sense.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Thank you. Now I would like to direct your attention to something completely new.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

It's-- You mentioned it yesterday, it's these 'voluntary statements' that you were-- you were asked to fill, you didn't even fill out-- you didn't even fill out at times.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Remember what I am talking about?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. They were-- I-- I didn't know what to think of them at first, but I eventually figured-- I mean I figured that they were equivalent of the sworn statements, because of the way it was set up, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, before we get to talk about any particular, can you please explain for Colonel Lind what the voluntary statement's are?

Pfc. Manning

Well, they were documents that the Navy uses to-- to document a statement. So-- so it-- essentially a sworn statement, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, when were they used?

Pfc. Manning

When were they used? I don't know, but the Department of the Navy uses it for all kinds of stuff, and I mean that broadly. I don't-- I don't know specifically what it can or should be used for, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, you normally had them when there was an exception to like rec hall was cut short-- you chose to watch TV instead of going to rec hall. That is when you used them correct?

Pfc. Manning

That is whenever they-- whenever they said that I had to fill them out--

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

--that-- I did not. I was confused by that, and I was uncomfortable with those particular document, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. But in general, that was-- that was-- without talking about any specific document yet-- in general that when it came up, while you were confined at Quantico was when you made a choice, and they wanted you to fill out a document to reflect that choice?

Pfc. Manning

It seemed like it. It seemed like that. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, the-- the first one I would like to talk about is-- [as you go?] in chronological order--

Judge Lind

Where am I going to find these?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, your Honor.

Judge Lind

If they're already enclosures here in filings you can just tell me where it is?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am. And, they might not be enclosures or we would have to search for them. So, this is easier than.

Judge Lind

Please, also Major Fein, if we are using any documents, that haven't been entered into the record as enclosures, please [missed a few words]...

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am. Your honor, the 'voluntary statements' are marked as appellate exhibit 426 Charlie.

I'm handing Private First Class Manning, 426 Charlie. [Missed a statement].

As you see, Private First Class Manning, this appellate exhibit there [missed a word] in reverse chronological order--

Pfc. Manning

Okay.

Prosecution (Fein)

--and we are going to start in chronological order. So, that in mind.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, the first-- the first one is recorded-- it was from 14 December 2010.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And this is where, you chose to forgo rec time because, because you left Quantico for the day and it was too close to dinner?

Pfc. Manning

Unfortunately, yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, so you chose-- so, instead you--

Pfc. Manning

Oh. No. No, on 14 December they did not have the ability to do rec call for me, so they told me to fill out a 'voluntary statement'.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so-- so they didn't allow you to do rec call--

Pfc. Manning

They didn't have enough time to do it, no.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so they didn't have enough time. They asked you to fill out this statement--

Pfc. Manning

They ordered me to, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

They ordered you to fill out the 'voluntary statement'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Master Sergeant Papakie.

Prosecution (Fein)

On 14 December 2010?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Let's go to the-- the next one, please. Dated 20 December 2010?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And on this one, this is where-- where the statement says-- the statement here that you wrote says that you voluntarily changed you rec time and then this voluntary statement occurred?

Pfc. Manning

The one that I am looking at says, the 20th of December?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes.

Pfc. Manning

So it's 43335 at the bates [missed word]?

Prosecution (Fein)

That is correct.

Pfc. Manning

Okay. Yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then on-- so let's go to the next one. On 21 December 2010?

Pfc. Manning

21 December?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes. 21 December. So this would be on the bottom left, bates number 43328.

Pfc. Manning

I don't-- I don't recall the circumstances regarding this one , sir.

But I think it was-- I think it was-- I don't know if it was snowy or whatever, but I wasn't able to go to outdoor rec, so they told me to fill out this out.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, they-- they said, you will not do rec time and then you fill out the 'voluntary statement'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. That's how it worked, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Alright. So, next in line please. So, this will be dated 25 December 2010?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Actually, I'm sorry this one's dated 28 December, but on 25 December 2010, that was Christmas of 2010, you also chose to shorten your rec time that day, but refused to sign a voluntary statement.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir-- because it was getting-- it was getting unusual and I was uncomfortable, because it has this section at the bottom, which I started to cross out-- where it says, 'I have been sworn to this statement by blank.'

And, you know, they were ordering me to fill this out, and I wasn't comfortable with it-- wasn't sure what the legal status of this document was, and they were telling me to do something that I wasn't sure was acquired illegally, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so on 25 December, you decided or you refused to sign a voluntary statement?

Pfc. Manning

On 25 December-- yes, because I-- again it was getting-- I was getting uncomfortable filling out these-- these forms.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you were allowed to not sign them, correct? But, you refused--

Pfc. Manning

They were not exactly happy about it--

Prosecution (Fein)

--the Brig said, 'Okay.'

Pfc. Manning

--I remember-- and I don't know who the DBS was at the time, but they-- they can't force me to sign the document.

They started-- I mean they were-- they were-- I mean, the way I was perceiving it was that it was an order.

'Here is a voluntary statement. Sign this.'

That was how it was initially going, and then-- and then I got uncomfortable and I-- and I started to wonder, 'well, is this proper?' sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So then now the next one in the packet that was signed-- 28 December 2010-- so its the bates number on the bottom left 43327.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, that one you did. You voluntarily chose to forgo rec time, because you wanted to watch a certain TV show?

Pfc. Manning

This is 3327? That is not what I am reading.

Prosecution (Fein)

3327?

Pfc. Manning

That is what I am looking at, 43327?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes. On the 28th of December.

Pfc. Manning

No. It says, 'Television call being secured, due to medication call. Sleep medication being given at 20-- at 20 hundred.' I was be told because I was being given sleep medication, I had-- I had to have my television secured.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

So, they-- so, Sergeant Garnet [sp.] gave me this, said, 'Fill this out.'

And that is why I crossed through a lot of this-- I crossed out the sworn part, because, you know, I crossed out the, 'I am freely and voluntarily,' and a lot of-- there's a lot of wording of this language that I crossed out and put initials by, because it wasn't correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, you weren't going to sign a voluntary statement with that sort of language that is crossed off on this?

Pfc. Manning

Definitely not, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Thank you. Cause you were worried to fill one of these out?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir. And, that's the way I was-- I was taking this was-- this was. 'Here is a voluntary statement. Fill this out.' I mean it wasn't unambiguous--

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure.

Pfc. Manning

--un or an--

Prosecution (Fein)

Could you flip now to the next one in the line, from 16 January 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Bates number 43324. Now on this on-- it-- it states where you wrote, 'securing recreation call due to conflict of scheduling of weekly television shows.' And then you signed this one.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, there was a-- there was a television show that I wanted to-- that-- that I was wanting to see, so I asked if I could-- if I could have recreation call later, and this is on the 16th.

I asked if I could have recreation call later, and-- then later Sergeant Garnet [sp.] again came by and gave me this, and told me to fill this out.

And, it didn't have the 'sworn' language that I could cross, because it-- there is no 'sworn' language at the bottom.

Prosecution (Fein)

But they crossed out the same portion and [re?]initialed on the top?

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

Changing it from 'voluntary' to something else?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then on-- if you-- you flip again-- on 6 February 2011, this seems to be similar-- 'refusing rec call due to schedule clash between TV'?

Pfc. Manning

Again, it was the same-- it was a very similar thing, where I-- I mean normally I would be able to, you know, they would give me some options, as to when recreation would be, and TV call and recreations call, depending on the calls of the day, were clashing.

So-- so sometimes they would-- they would-- they would give me this at the end of the day, and say, 'You have not been able,' you know, and-- and I don't remember-- I don't remember what days these were-- these were on, sir.

But, you know, there were times whenever-- I felt-- I really felt uncomfortable with filling these out, because it seemed like I-- it seemed like it was not-- it was not proper for me to be filling these out, but I didn't want to refuse an immediate direct order, because I didn't how-- I didn't know what to do in those circumstances.

Prosecution (Fein)

But on-- but on Christmas day you did refuse to sign one?

Pfc. Manning

On Christmas day, yes, I did.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, previously you had refused to sign it?

Pfc. Manning

I had refused to sign it, and it was uncomfortable-- there was some problems with that.

I think Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart came to talk to me about that. I don't remember.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now I would like to talk to you-- because that it sitting right here-- but on 16 February 2011, you also made a choice to forgo rec time, cause you were out of the Brig all day for the 706 [board].

Pfc. Manning

That's not correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Then, what did happen that cause you to refuse a voluntary statement?

Pfc. Manning

Well, because I was being told to fill out a voluntary statement for recreation-- to-- to cancel recreation call that I did-- that I did want to attend.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

Because the-- I would-- I would come back from the 706 board, and they would be slightly settling down for the day, and they would be like, 'Oh,' you know, 'your recreation call,' you know, 'Your not going to be able to do it. Fill out this voluntary statement.'

Prosecution (Fein)

But, the voluntary statement does-- it is-- could be sworn, like it has the language at the bottom you crossed out.

So, you could have actually written what you just said on the form, swore to it, signed it, and given it to them.

Pfc. Manning

No.

Prosecution (Fein)

'I do not voluntarily do this.'

Pfc. Manning

No, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You couldn't have done it?

Pfc. Manning

My understanding was that I could not, sir. They would throw away the form if I did that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Did-- did they tell you that?

Pfc. Manning

They threw-- Sergeant Garnet on one particular occasion. Took the form. Ripped it up. And, gave me another one and said, 'Fill this out the way that I say that you fill it out.'

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so you-- so, they told you-- or they would discard it, and they told you that if you wrote under sworn-- sworn statements saying, 'That I absolutely wanted rec call, and you took it away from me,' then that would be torn up or destroyed?

Pfc. Manning

Exactly, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

I mean I was-- I was very-- and I brought this up with Mr. Coombs, and, you know, I was just told to not-- I mean, not fill any of these-- not deal with any of these voluntary statements. And, it was very uncomfortable, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, on 27 February 2011, you were sick at the time?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you did not have rec call that day. The records show that it was because you voluntarily didn't want to have rec call?

Pfc. Manning

I think that one...that one was a legitimate.

Prosecution (Fein)

But you still refused to sign a voluntary statement?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I had advice of counsel not to fill out any more voluntary statements starting around this early February time frame.

Prosecution (Fein)

That is 27 February. But-- so that one--

Pfc. Manning

Well, no following this last one with-- where I got the, 'I have been sworn...I have been sworn to this statement by Corporal Stockten [sp.].'

After that happened, I brought that up with Mr. Coombs, and he advised me not to touch any 'voluntary statements' anymore.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And then-- so that was on the 27 February?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, did you tell the Brig that?

Pfc. Manning

They knew, yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, originally when presented the option to sign a 'voluntary statement', you opted for it?

Pfc. Manning

There were earlier 'voluntary statements' that are similar to that, that are not in the records for instances like that. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you did originally sign them?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I would-- I would fill them out, and then-- for things-- for things where I was actually voluntarily saying, 'No,' you know, 'I don't want to do this.'

But there were instances, where they started around the December timeframe, where they would not be able to fill out, you know-- they would not be able to-- to execute the recreation call within-- before taps-- before the schedule change, and they would give me the form, and I would have to fill-- they would tell me that I had to fill it out.

And, I figured-- and, I was uncomfortable with this. I didn't know if they were just trying to cover themselves for not being able to-- for not scheduling a recreation call.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you weren't aware though at the time that they were making the log entries and had their own scheduling, since you refused to sign.

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I was definitely aware of that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, if you were aware that they were doing that, if you refused to sign, then why would you be compelled to sign?

Pfc. Manning

Because they would give me these forms, and they would stand there-- I mean Sergeant Barnet [sp.] in particular was one, who was giving me these forms, and saying, you know-- and standing there, 'This is a direct order,' you know, 'Sign this voluntary statement.'

I mean, I caved in a coupled times, and you can see, but after I changed the wording, the language, because I was not comfortable with signing anything that looked like a sworn statement, because it-- because I mean a sworn statement is a very serious thing, you know, declaration on penalty of perjury as well.

I didn't-- I don't feel comfortable, because I wasn't sure what the legal status of these documents were basically. I am more familiar with Army sworn statements that have a lot more language to it-- a lot more boxes to fill in et cetera et cetera.

And, that is what I was more familiar with, because these didn't have a lot of that-- those boxes in it and et cetera. I wasn't sure what the legal status of these documents.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, that started in December, correct? Before December you were signing them?

Pfc. Manning

Well we have-- we have the records of these [missed word]. There were instances were-- were I-- before this-- were I would fill out a sworn statement or a voluntary statement, not knowing it was a sworn, not knowing that it could be used as a sworn statement.

I don't know. Again, I don't know the legal status of these documents. I still don't, and, you know-- I filled them out before hand with no issue, because, you know, my recreation call would be secured, you know-- because I didn't want to finish my recreation call.

I mean, we are talking about November October timeframe of 2010, but whenever they started to not be able to fill that in, and tell me to that I needed to fill these out, I got uncomfortable, sir.

And, so that is whenever these crossing out and these awkward moments started happening, sir. It was around the December timeframe.

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. Your Honor, I am retrieving from the [witness?] what has been marked as appellate exhibit 426 Charlie.

Private First Class Manning I would like to now bring you to the time that, that you talked about yesterday when you were-- when you were standing at attention at parade rest naked in the morning.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

That is the morning of-- of 2 March 2011?

Pfc. Manning

Early March-- I don't-- I don't recall the exact dates, if you have something to remind me, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

I actually don't right this second, so-- but early March. Will you please explain to the Court--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--so the normal-- what the normal procedure was in the morning time wise? Maybe this will help. When did-- when were you woken up?

Pfc. Manning

Okay. Zero five was-- we would have 'Reveille Reveille Reveille,' announced at zero five in the morning normally.

And, then if-- sometime it would be immediately, 'Stand by for count.' Sometimes we would do a hygiene call or either give us our-- or give me a razor.

I'd shave my face, and then return it. And, then we would have count. Sometime-- it wasn't always-- sometime it was count first. Sometimes it was 'hygiene call' first, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And that's at zero five? And when did the count occur, after 'Reveille Reveille Reveille'?

Pfc. Manning

05:01 as early as that. As late as 05:20, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so just depending on when the counter came around?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. And, when 'Stand by for count,' would be announced, sir.

Typically-- typically it was done very-- very quickly, sir. And the DBS was the counter, the Duty Brig Supervisor.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, 'Reveille Reveille Reveille'--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--and that's waking everyone up?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir--

Prosecution (Fein)

And, then--

Pfc. Manning

--and, turning the lights on, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--turn the lights on. And then, when were you given your clothing black to put on after-- at that point?

Pfc. Manning

On 3 March?

Prosecution (Fein)

No. On the normal day.

Pfc. Manning

On the normal day? After I had-- after I had my clothing removed-- so post 2 March or 3 March, it was sometimes as early as 04:50.

Sometime it would be after 'Reveille Reveille Reveille'. So, it would be within a few minutes. Sometime-- sometimes-- it was always-- it was always before.

Well, it wasn't always-- for the first couple days, it was not before count.

Prosecution (Fein)

And the clothing wasn't put on the-- where--

Pfc. Manning

[Missed word] it was put in a feed tray, where-- just the opening of the cell door, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And so, it was laid there. So, sometimes early it was there--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--and sometimes you woke up and it wasn't there?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then they would be brought to you?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Judge Lind

Major Fein, I don't want to interrupt you. Can I just get a point of clarification? Before the 2nd of March what was the status of your clothing at night?

Pfc. Manning

I still had some. I mean-- I still had underwear then.

Judge Lind

At any point before 2 March, since you arrive, did you have anything more than underwear?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I did, Ma'am. When-- can you repeat the question, your Honor?

Judge Lind

[to prosecutor] Alright, I think you know where I am going.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yeah. I do, Ma'am.

Judge Lind

I'll let you make that--

Prosecution (Fein)

Alright, Private First Class Manning, before 2 March, you were still allowed to sleep in your underwear, correct?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I still had-- I still had some under garments and socks, I think.

Prosecution (Fein)

But not-- but not your entire compliment of clothing?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so during that time, prior to the Brig ordering your underwear to be removed--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--you-- how was that clothing then given back to you, like the sweats that you were talked about earlier?

Pfc. Manning

Oh. Before it was-- before 3 March it was placed-- it was usually-- it was usually given to me within ten to fifteen minutes of 'Reveille Reveille Reveille'.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, is it-- is it the same as you just talked about as either right before or right after by like ten minutes?

Pfc. Manning

It varied a lot, sir. I mean-- sometimes it was after count, sometimes it was before count, but, you know, it-- I mean, sometime-- sometimes I would be standing-- but I was always standing with-- with clothing on at that point, whether it was a low level of clothing or full uniform-- I mean, and that was the variation.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, what you testified about yesterday was on that morning, you were ordered to stand at attention or parade rest, naked?

Pfc. Manning

Parade rest, attention, and then parade rest, again.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, you were specifically ordered to not have your clothing on or to cover yourself, because you did not have clothing?

Pfc. Manning

The wording of the statement, and I can't see, because I don't have glasses on. So, I can't see who is in the observation booth.

The door was cracked open. And, I stood with the prevention of injury blanket over me as I normally did, on-- whenever I was on 'suicide watch' or 'suicide risk' status, for--

Then the door opened a crack, and a voice from inside, one of the guards said, 'Detainee Manning, is that how you stand at parade rest?'

And, I asked again or I-- I was confused by this. I was not sure. I mean, I was like, 'How do you want me to stand?' And he is like, 'Is that how you stand at parade rest?' I understood that to mean, you know, put the blanket down.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

So, I put the blanket down.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, the guard did not actually say, 'Put the blanket down'? He said, 'Is that how you stand at parade rest?'

Pfc. Manning

'Is that how you stand at parade rest, detainee Manning?'

Prosecution (Fein)

'Detainee Manning,' but not 'Detainee Manning, put the blanket down'?

Pfc. Manning

Correct. It's a-- it's an-- it's an implied task, not a direct order.

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure, but you implied it, cause it's an implied task?

Pfc. Manning

Well I-- I asked for clarification on that.

Prosecution (Fein)

And?

Pfc. Manning

And, I just got the same statement again similarly.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay--

Pfc. Manning

--cause I mean it's not an illegal order, or anything like that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Oh, I understand. I mean--

Pfc. Manning

--I mean it wasn't like-- the wording I had been given by the staff was that any order that you are given, unless it immediately-- immediately causes you danger or harm, is a proper one, until you-- and then execute it, you know, unless it's 'life, leg, or eyesight'.

I think the tarantula-- I think tarantula jar was an example that was used a lot, you know.

If a guard orders you to put your hand in a tarantula jar, don't-- don't do that, you know. Refuse that order, but, you know, anything else a part from a-- anything else that's not-- that's not immediately dangerous-- that's not immediately harmful or dangerous, you execute that, and then complain about it later, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So-- I understand that. What I am trying to understand and really if not-- me, I am trying to have Colonel Lind understand is, that-- so that morning you stood up and you had your POI blanket on you--

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--you didn't have your underwear on, because you were ordered the day before to remove them--

Pfc. Manning

--I didn't have glasses either, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--or your glasses. And, you had your blanket on you?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then the DBS--

Pfc. Manning

Not the DBS. The guard inside the booth.

Prosecution (Fein)

The individual we saw on the video in the observation booth...

Pfc. Manning

--the observation booth. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Then ordered you to or made a comment, 'That's not how you stand at parade rest--'

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

'--detainee Manning?'

Pfc. Manning

'Detainee Manning, is that how you stand at parade rest?'

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you responded?

Pfc. Manning

I responded-- I mean I was looking for the correct rank as well, because I can't see the guard. So I don't know if it's Corporal. I don't know--

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure.

Pfc. Manning

--what rank it is, but I guessed at Lance Corporal, and I didn't get corrected on that, so I said, 'Excuse me, Lance Corporal,' or, 'Can you,' you know, 'rephrase that, Lance Corporal?'

And, he said, 'Detainee Manning,' or something to the effect-- or something to the effect of, 'Detainee Manning, is that how you-- is that how you stand at parade rest,' and I don't remember is it was, '--with a blanket over you?'

I don't recall if that was said or not, but it was certainly implied that, 'Take the blanket off.'

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. But, did you seek clarification?

Pfc. Manning

I did, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then what did you-- what did you ask or say?

Pfc. Manning

That was how-- that was how-- that was what I did. I was like-- I was like, 'Can you rephrase that,' I mean, 'Is that-- is that what you want me to do? Do you want me to set the blanket down?'

And, there was a moment where, I would [missed word] that was, 'Yes,' you know. I did-- I did seek clarification. I remember that.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you specifically asked them, 'Do you mean you want me to put the blanket down?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So you didn't say, 'What do you want me to do?' It was, 'You want me to put--'

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean yeah. I have to-- I have to word things from sort of a third person, because it's a-- it's a Brig, sir.

So, I would have to word-- word it as, 'Detainee Manning requests clarification on the order--' or something like that. Something that I had to.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. But so, you would then say, 'Detainee requests clarification on that order?'

Pfc. Manning

Yeah. But I don't know-- I don't know if that is exactly the wording I said. I was groggy. I mean-- it was 05 in the morning, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

No. I understand. Unfortunately, I understand.

So, you would have to ask it in third person? Which does seem confusing. So, you answer in third person, but are you answering-- saying basically, 'Detainee Manning needs the order repeated,' or is it--

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall the exact phrasing I said.

Prosecution (Fein)

--okay, and what was the response back from the guard within the hut?

Pfc. Manning

Essentially, 'Yes. Place--' I mean it wasn't, 'Place the blanket down,' but I understood-- I think I asked, 'Do you want me to put the blanket down?'

Prosecution (Fein)

But you have to ask in the third person--

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

--that seems confusing right now?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. It's very confusing.

Prosecution (Fein)

--so you would ask in third person, 'Do you mean you want me to put my blanket down?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes. 'Detainee Manning, request whether I need to put the [missed word] blanket down, Sir?'

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, so you asked that?

Pfc. Manning

Something to that effect, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then the response you got back was, 'Yes.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So it wasn't about you not standing at parade rest. You are saying, it was actually then about you standing without clothing on or without the blank on, excuse me?

Pfc. Manning

Well the-- the phrasing of the question from the Brig beginning was, you know, 'Detainee Manning, is that-- is that how you stand at parade rest?'

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure. Sure. But, as you said before, you were implying something from there-- from the original question.

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, cause you could be holding a blanket a lot of different ways, that could be a modified parade rest or not.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And this guard was standing in the guard shack?

Pfc. Manning

Sitting down in a chair. I could hear the wheels, but never-- I can't really see a lot. I see the-- I see the mirror-- what I call-- I mean, it's a window, but I see, you know-- I see the reflection, and then there's the door, and the door is cracked open, and they usually sit on a wheelie chair with five wheels, and-- and-- they-- whoever it was-- I don't know who it was, sir-- opened the door, and said, 'Detainee Manning, is that how you stand at parade rest?'

Prosecution (Fein)

Did they close the door afterwards?

Pfc. Manning

No.

Prosecution (Fein)

Or, were they standing there in the doorway?

Pfc. Manning

They had--

Pfc. Manning

--or sitting, excuse me.

Pfc. Manning

--sitting with the door cracked open, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Got it. Do you remember later that morning, not to long after, Staff Sergeant Terry [sp.] showing up?

Pfc. Manning

I do. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, do you remember him counseling you that morning that you should and will never stand naked without clothing?

Pfc. Manning

No. I don't recall that, sir. I don't recall it being like that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. We've gone for about an hour, do-- do you need a comfort break?

Pfc. Manning

I could do with one [missed a few words].

Prosecution (Fein)

Your Honor, United States moves for a fifteen minute break.

Judge Lind

Fifteen minutes?

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am.

Judge Lind

Alright. Any objection?

Defense (Coombs)

No, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Court is in recess until 2:15 or [missed a few words]

ALL RISE

ALL RISE

Judge Lind

Please be seated. This Article 39(a) Session is called to order. Let the record reflect all parties present when the Court last recessed are again present in Court. Major Fein.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am. Private First Class Manning, I would like to now direct you...I guess for your frame of reference and kind of [missed word].

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

When you were still in Iraq on 27 May 2010, yesterday you testified that was when essentially CID showed up and you were ordered into your CHU?

Pfc. Manning

I never-- when-- I never saw my CHU after that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. You were ordered into a-- a [missed word]?

Pfc. Manning

An interview room at the Brigade Headquarters building, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And where did you then sleep at night?

Pfc. Manning

They brought me to a completely different CHU.

Prosecution (Fein)

And that's were-- your-- you-- where you stayed or slept with two guards?

Pfc. Manning

At night, yes, sir. Two guards and some visitors.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, sir. Ah, excuse me [for calling him 'sir'].

You were also ordered, the same time that you were in that-- that other CHU. You were ordered not to access a computer?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. That is correct, sir. Well, not immediately. I didn't-- I didn't know that.

It was not until the next day after I work up, and the following day that I was nearby to a computer, and I was about to go use it, and then they told me that I couldn't-- that I was not suppose to, sir. So, if that [missed a few words].

Prosecution (Fein)

So, on 28 May?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. The following day, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then on 28 May, that same day, you had requested Specialist Shaab [sp.] from the S2 Shop to stop by your CHU at 9:30 that night?

Pfc. Manning

Schwaab [sp.]. Yes, 21 hundred, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

To stop by that evening.

Defense (Coombs)

Objection, your Honor. Relevance?

Judge Lind

Overruled.

Prosecution (Fein)

Go ahead?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I did. To come to my-- to come to my-- after she knew she was available, and-- and I told her where the-- which-- which CHU it was, because there's a trailer, and then there's-- it's split into different sections.

So, I told her which-- which LSA [Logistics Support Area] it was in her [missed two words] in was in et cetera.

Prosecution (Fein)

And she showed up and you asked her to [stay?] that night?

Pfc. Manning

She came a little earlier, yes. Yes. So I think it was 20-- 23rd.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, and then when she showed up, you handed her a piece of paper with your Gmail account username and password on it?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I did, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you asked her to check your email for you?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. And, I also asked her if she had any books that I could read...that I could borrow, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, she went, left, checked the email and came back and reported to you what she found.

Pfc. Manning

She...she told me what the subjects were in the inbox. And, she also got me 'The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo' as a book, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then Private First Class Manning once you were in Kuwait, you contacted your aunt to update your Facebook Page?

Pfc. Manning

I did. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And it was updated-- while you were in Kuwait, you had her updated it to say, 'Some have you may have heard, that I have been arrested for disclosing classified information to unauthorized persons. See--,' and then it's the web site for the Apache video.

Defense (Coombs)

Objection, your Honor. Again, relevance.

Judge Lind

What is the relevance?

Prosecution (Fein)

Your Honor, the relevance is yesterday, Private First Class Manning testified that when he left Iraq and moved to Kuwait, he was sort of out of it, and doesn't really remember what occurred, and there is entire dialogue yesterday about that.

Judge Lind

Overruled.

Pfc. Manning

Can you repeat the question for me?

Prosecution (Fein)

When you contacted your aunt in Kuwait. You asked her to post to Facebook?

Pfc. Manning

I did. To post to Facebook, yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

And you asked her to post, 'Some of you may have heard that I have been arrested for disclosure of classified information to unauthorized persons. See...' and then its the web site for the Apache video disclosure.

Pfc. Manning

I did not tell her to write that, no. She wrote that. I told her to put a posting on my Facebook to let everybody know that I was alive and well.

Just to make sure that everybody that knew-- because my-- my concern was that-- was that nobody-- because if I'm-- if-- if I'm going 72, you know, 96 hours-- 72 or 96 hours without updating anybody, I mean I was worried that somebody might think that I might have passed away-- I might have got killed or injured or something like that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now, to bring you back to the Brig, and-- and really to focus on visitation and visitors. You-- you were allowed to have visitors, while you were at Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I was.

Prosecution (Fein)

And you chose who can and cannot visit you?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. Well, to an extent. I did-- I didn't-- I didn't know-- I didn't always know if somebody was coming.

And, I wasn't-- I wasn't sure if I was able to refuse a visitor once they had been placed on the list. So, that was a...that was a grey area that I wasn't sure of, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, so-- that makes sense. You had also-- you have-- it was your decision whether someone was allowed to visit you at all?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

If they weren't on your list, then they could not visit you?

Pfc. Manning

Unless it was an official visit. Then I could not-- could not-- then I definitely could not refuse them.

Prosecution (Fein)

So you could choose, if you wanted to add anyone from a family member to a member of the press, US Congressman, anyone you chose, you-- you could decide to put on your list?

Pfc. Manning

No. The Brig order specified that it was only persons that I knew, and persons that I was like friends with or family members.

It wasn't like business. It specifically said, you know, no business relationships, or anything like that.

I don't remember the exact wording, but something to that effect. So, it was-- it was mostly intended for friends and family.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, it-- actually I think it's-- correct me if I am wrong-- the Brig Order says, unless you have prior relationship with an individual--

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

--that you could not add them to your list.

Pfc. Manning

Right, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, Chief Averhart permitted you to add people who you didn't have a prior relationship with to your list.

Pfc. Manning

I wasn't sure of that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you were allowed to add people to your list that you didn't have a prior relationship with?

Pfc. Manning

I wasn't sure of that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. When presented--

Pfc. Manning

--because I didn't have a document that overrode the Brig Order-- the Brig Order, the guidance that I had, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Sure. So, when presented with the option specifically you chose not to add [missed title Fein gave] Juan Mendez from the United Nations?

Pfc. Manning

No. He's not a friend or family member, sir. That was my understanding was that I could not add him, and then if I were to add him, then I would face-- that I could face a discipline-- disciplinary action.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And did that [missed word] go, you could have added, for instance, Representative Kucinich to your visitor's list?

Pfc. Manning

I have no idea about that. I mean, that's a grey area.

I mean, I don't know this person personally, but, you know, the members of Congress have on official-- they have the-- they are working in an official capacity at the US Capitol, you know-- US Capitol, and a part of-- and there are several branches of Government.

So, I didn't know whether or not, you know-- I know-- I know there are legislative liaisons for the different branches and things, but I didn't, you know, I didn't know what that was, but he was-- he did not have a role with-- for the added people to the list.

He did not fit into the category of somebody I had a prior relationship with in terms of friends or family, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So it's still on the visitors. But, on 16 March 2011, you instructed the Brig to remove many people from your list, and you actually split up the document?

Pfc. Manning

No. It was-- what it was, was-- it wasn't necessarily that I-- that I wanted to remove them.

It was that I wanted to remove two people in particular that I remember, and they gave me an entirely new set of forms.

And a lot of the information was bad on some of these forms, because they had been written, when I first got there.

So, a lot-- and some of them just contained garbage information, like addresses that were totally wrong or the names that were misspelled and things like that.

So, I-- I transferred only-- I transferred some of the addresses over that I knew would-- could potentially visit me, and I knew the information was-- as far as I knew, correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, I would like to go through some of these names to...to understand how these would fall in? So, the first name removed was your cousin, Becky?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, Daniel Clark was removed?

Pfc. Manning

I don't-- I thought-- I thought he was still-- I thought I moved him over.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, who was Daniel Clark?

Pfc. Manning

Daniel Clark is a-- is a friend of mine that I knew in-- starting in 2009, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You remove, you talked about yesterday, a gentleman named David House?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, who is David House?

Pfc. Manning

David House was-- I mean he was an acquaintance that I met through Danny Clark, or Mr. Daniel Clark, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Would you describe Mr. House as an activist?

Pfc. Manning

I have no idea. I've-- I mean he certainly became one. I didn't-- whenever I-- whenever I first met him I thought he was just a-- I thought he was just a regular guy. I saw him as sort of an acquaintance of mine through a friend.

Prosecution (Fein)

John [sounds like 'Coke-ly'], you removed him?

Pfc. Manning

I did, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Jason Edwards?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Toby [Sounds like 'Corenta']?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

[Sounds like 'Drew' and last name two or three syllables, starts with a plosive or derivative, like 'Pare-gets' or 'Para-gets']?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Nate Kennedy?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, Jordan Davis?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Joshua Solely [sp.]?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

George Lawson [sp.]?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Chris Wood?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Paul Steven Lopez?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Glenn Greenwald?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Jeff Patterson?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Trevor Fitzgibbons?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Who's Trevor Fitzgibbons?

Pfc. Manning

He is-- he is somebody that I met through-- potentially-- Mr. Coombs had introduced me to Mr. Fitzgibbons.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, who was he?

Pfc. Manning

I mean I wasn't really sure of his status. I mean, he was some kind of-- he was some kind of like PR consultant that he was looking at-- he was potentially using.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you say, you met him through Mr. Coombs?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, he was someone you didn't know prior to confinement?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you were allowed to have him on your roster?

Pfc. Manning

From what I understood, yes. Because of-- I mean I didn't whether he was-- I didn't know what status he was in, but Mr. Coombs said that-- that it was fine. So, I didn't-- I don't know, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, when you added him to the-- to the list-- that thing had your mail and visitors, it wasn't rejected by the-- by the Brig?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So on the topic of visitors, you did receive visitors periodically through your pretrial confinement at Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I don't-- I don't recall exactly the dates and times or anything like that, but I did. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Would you average, you would say, almost every weekend?

Pfc. Manning

No. It felt like-- it felt like longer, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you were permitted, Saturdays and Sundays only or Holidays, to have visitors?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, Sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, when you met with these visitors, these meetings were recorded?

Pfc. Manning

To my understand, yes, starting in like September timeframe. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, privileged meetings were not recorded [missed a few words]?

Pfc. Manning

To my understand, yes. We did it in a separate booth. One that did not have a sign that said, 'This-- this booth is subject to monitoring and recording,' or something to that effect.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, like we talked about before, when the ones that were recorded, you signed a consent form, and so did the other participant?

Pfc. Manning

To my understanding for-- with-- for some of the visits with civilians, yes that was the case.

Prosecution (Fein)

And the privileged ones with defense counsel as you spoke of or even psychiatrists, chaplains, those weren't-- you weren't signing consent forms, and to the best of your knowledge, they weren't recorded?

Pfc. Manning

I thought the-- I thought that it could be monitored-- I mean, they didn't write but did think-- the Brig thought that they could be monitored by guards for a period of time, where they could sit in the room, but not necessarily record anything.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, for instance-- well just, I guess-- you weren't signing a consent form, even like forensic psychiatrists, Doctor Hocter, Doctor Malone, [missed word identified for Doctor Russell] Doctor Russell. There were no forms being signed, this consenting.

Pfc. Manning

That is correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you even had for instance, you just mentioned, that you were introduced to Mr. Fitzgibbons by Mr. Coombs. Mr. Coombs even was able to sit in those meeting, but had to still sign a consent form, since he is your attorney.

Pfc. Manning

I guess. I guess. I wasn't privy to the other person signing anything.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you didn't witness them on the other side of the glass?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct. I didn't-- I didn't know if they would sign the document. And, I didn't always-- I wasn't always given these forms to fill out, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. So, Private First Class Manning, what I would like to now do is talk to you about some of these meetings and conversations you had with these individuals, while they visited you at Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

Okay, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Your Honor, for judicial economy purposes, any of these recordings were provided in enclosure 49 on the CD to the Court.

And, if there is a question I will be able to cite the exact hour, minute and second. [to witness] Private First Class Manning on 18 September 2010, you met with Mr. David House and Mr. Daniel Clark?

Pfc. Manning

18 December?

Prosecution (Fein)

18 September. Thank you.

Pfc. Manning

Okay. September. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

2010. You-- they asked you, 'How are they, the Brig, treating you?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And you answered, 'Pretty good. It's not bad. It's not Oz,' or something like that?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And 'Oz' is a...an HBO show about prison?

Pfc. Manning

Ah, yes, with Maloney [sp.] and some other actors.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And then-- so, but your answer was, 'It's pretty good. It's not bad.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Your answer to them.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. I was trying to reassure them.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, when asked by Mr. House and Mr. Clark about you-- specifically about your prevention of injury status. You specifically stated a few things, 'It's unusual,' then you followed it with, 'My circumstances are not common,' and then that, 'They,' the Brig, 'are not too bad. And, I understand it all'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, that's correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, at the time, when you had Mr. House and Mr. Clark there. Rather than mentioning anything else this whole recording about your alleged treatment, you were actually at that time, more focused on hiring private investigators to find a fundraiser for you?

Pfc. Manning

I considered that. Well, I had told them that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Told them what, I'm sorry?

Pfc. Manning

I had told them that I was thinking about that. I'm-- I'm not quite-- the private investigator? Like can you-- can you clarify--?

Prosecution (Fein)

Absolutely. So, rather then ever mentioning anything that would even allude to your, to negative treatment by the Brig--

Pfc. Manning

Right.

Prosecution (Fein)

--you actually had most of the conversation focused on hiring a private investigator to find a fundraiser for you.

Pfc. Manning

A potential-- and I am also just a-- he is just a friend that I had previously who had just dropped off the radar, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, so 18th--

Pfc. Manning

--I wasn't-- I wasn't quite serious about it, but, you know, I said-- I said-- I think I said to Mr. Clark-- it was Mr. Clark who I was directing it to, but, 'It wouldn't seem like a bad idea.' It was more like a funny-- 'Hey, can you help me find this person?'

Prosecution (Fein)

--Okay, then-- but not on 18 September 2010--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--on that day, when talking to friends, you were more concerned about other issues, than ever talking about your treatment at Quantico Brig?

Pfc. Manning

Absolutely, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. I would like to direct your attention to a few weeks later, 25 September 2010.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

On 25 September 2010, you met with your aunt?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

At the very end of your meeting, your-- your aunt spoke about of asked you, 'Was there anything else you can think about that you needed other than a little cash'? At that point you said, 'No not really. Just tell everyone that I am doing fine.'

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, then your aunt mentioned or replied, 'I will. They are raising money, so that's good.'

Pfc. Manning

I guess. I mean I'm not sure if that the-- is that the-- I am not sure myself-- I don't recall if that the exact wording, but to get me money for-- to fill in my Brig account?

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Your account to get haircuts, and--

Pfc. Manning

Exactly.

Prosecution (Fein)

--and other sundry items?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then when your aunt continued to talk about the raise money, you said, 'I mean it's still going to be a while before the end of this confinement.'

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then at the end of the conversation, you said, 'Tell everyone I am doing fine.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, during this entire conversation on 25 September 2010 with your own aunt, you never mention anything about any type of treatment at Quantico, other than everything-- well, excuse me, your doing, 'fine'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now jumping a month-- actually, two months ahead, 13 November 2010, you met with, you met with your aunt again?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And during that meeting, the only complaint you had, was that no one had actually visited you at the Brig in almost a month?

Pfc. Manning

That's right.

Prosecution (Fein)

And actually didn't say anything about the Brig itself?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, on the 13 November 2010, again there was nothing else going on at the Brig that you felt compelled to tell you aunt about at that point?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I wasn't going to talk-- I wasn't going to anybody under the recording circumstances about my confinement conditions.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yesterday you talked about, that POI was the highest priority on your mind every single day--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. It was.

Prosecution (Fein)

--but you didn't take the opportunity, so far to this point, when you were visited by David House and Danny Clark in early September, you aunt again, your aunt again ever talk about your conditions at that point.

Pfc. Manning

After-- after they installed the recording that is true.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, the chance you actually had to talk about it, and have it memorialize, if it was said, you chose not to?

Pfc. Manning

Under those recording circumstances, yes, sir.

I directed all the confinement and correctional issues that I had to my counsel to give to family members and friends.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, on 21 November 2010, you met with Mr. David House?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The conversation started with updates on political and journalists network support for your developing case?

Pfc. Manning

On his end, he was talking about that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay, and then Mr. House told you that Mr. Coombs had asked you to get all the supporters together or asked him, and, 'Keep them quiet for now, so future pushes can be made through an aggressive PR campaign'?

Pfc. Manning

He might have said that, yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, at that point in your conversation, you were more focused on adding people to the public affairs list, by getting recommendations, than even taking the opportunity to talk about your own confinement?

Pfc. Manning

Correct, sir. Under those recording conditions, yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

And you even explained, under those conditions to Mr. House that-- that you been-- that have writing time, but you have chosen not to write?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Mr. House asked you if you needed anything? Asked you if you needed anything? And, you only discussed wanting cash and book? Cash for that account and more books?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. That's correct. Because they could-- from what I remember they could leave small amounts of cash into the-- at the Brig. I think they could leave a twenty dollar bill, or something like that.

Prosecution (Fein)

But not at like-- they couldn't use an ATM?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct. I didn't have a-- it wasn't like a swiping machine or anything like that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But also during that same conversation, rather than discussing any treatment-- any treatment or alleged mistreatment, you would rather-- you chose to discuss the possibility of having a WikiLeaks organization lawyer assisting Mr. Coombs?

Pfc. Manning

I did not. I did not discuss that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, you had a back and forth with Mr. House? He said it to you, and then you had a discussion about whether it would be a good discussion or not.

Pfc. Manning

That is correct. I mean I-- I was trying to avoid saying a lot during these conversations. I was mostly listening, sir. So, I was mostly trying to listen, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So-- so in that regard, when you did have the chance to at least talk. In this one conversation on 21 November 2010, you even were talking to Mr. House and asking about how the glasses looked on your face, because you weren't use to having-- normally didn't wear any glasses, but then started choosing to wear glasses?

Pfc. Manning

I'm not sure what you mean by that, sir? That I-- that I wanted to wear glasses?

Prosecution (Fein)

No. What you asked Mr. House was, how the glasses were looking, because you started wearing them again?

Pfc. Manning

Oh, yes. I did. I did ask him that.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then at the very end, when Mr. House finally asked you how you were doing, you simply answered, you're doing alright, and are 'pretty stable.' And I quote, you actually said, 'Better than a significant portion of the population.'

Pfc. Manning

I-- yes, I did say that.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then Mr. House on that date, 21 November, commented to you that you actually, 'doesn't even look like you have lost that much weight.'

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then you responded, something to the effect of, 'I've lost some muscle, but not really much weight.'

Pfc. Manning

Ah, yes. My muscle mass was turning to flab, [some of the side effects?].

Prosecution (Fein)

And then you were asked by Mr. House on 'Whether you had to perform hard labor?' And you replied, 'No. You just sit up a lot.'

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then he commented, that 'It seems that's a very sedentary lifestyle,' and you followed...you followed with, 'It's not too bad.'

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir. That is what I said.

Prosecution (Fein)

And after Mr. House said that, that 'You must be running out of things to do, by sitting all day,' you simply then explained that 'It wasn't that bad, like the people back in the Victorian age.'

Pfc. Manning

That is correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

Because you can specifically, 'Sit there, and think a lot.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now, Private First Class Manning, I'd like you to think back to Christmas Day, as you did before 25 December 2010.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You were visited by your cousin [Robin?].

Pfc. Manning

[Robin?] [missed a word, maybe last name] Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And on that day, 25 December 2010, you were asked whether you had seen yourself, or he had seen you on TV?

Pfc. Manning

Something to that effect, yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, your cousin then talked about-- he stated that, 'Yes, the TV's talking about your bad treatment in jail.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, you stated that, 'Yes. Mr. Coombs was very well spoken, and has some good talking point.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you did not even take that opportunity to discuss at all with your cousin your confinement conditions?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, you did focus on future talking points for the media?

Pfc. Manning

I am not sure what you mean by that question.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, rather than talking about confinement conditions, you were actually commenting on the different ways that talking points could be give, not about confinement, but generally family members talking to the media.

Pfc. Manning

I didn't want them talking to the media, sir...was what I want. That was a general thing was that I didn't want family members talking to people.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, so then later--

Pfc. Manning

--but it--

Prosecution (Fein)

--go ahead, please--

Pfc. Manning

--but-- I mean I was-- I was uncomfortable with family members talking to media in general, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Alright. Private First Class Manning, later during that same visit, rather than discussing any condition in the facility on 25 December 2010, you were focused on pictures of yourself on Facebook.

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You had your dialogue with your cousin and asking if certain ones could be taken off or others could [come? off?].

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Because-- when I did-- somebody in the family had access to that, because there were pictures that were up there, that had other people in them, and I was concerned about that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now, I would like to think back to 5 February 2011.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

This is the meeting where Mr. Coombs brought Mr. Trevor Fitzgibbons to meet you for the first time.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You spoke to Mr. Fitzgibbons and Mr. Coombs for more than an hour.

Pfc. Manning

Probably. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, during this conversation you spent all of the time focusing on developing your own public image, and public affairs campaign, and fundraising, and never spoke about your confinement conditions.

Pfc. Manning

That-- that-- I think that was the gist of the conversation. I don't know how much I took part in it-- I don't have-- I don't recall a lot, but that was a-- I tried to play a passive role in listening.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. And, then, at the end of the conversation actually, you will recollect, Mr. Coombs left.

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, it was just you and Mr. Fitzgibbons.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, at that point, Mr. Fitzgibbons said, 'Thank you for letting me help in anyway I can.' And that, he has been trying to use David House on the television. But even at that point-- even at that point when you are talking about David House on television, you never mentioned anything about your alleged confinement conditions.

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You both even joked about drinking Coke. That you were actually even getting caffeine in the Brig.

Pfc. Manning

It was a-- it was 'Volt' that I was drinking. It was a drink that they had at the OCS [Officer Candidate School]. I don't-- I don't recall-- maybe I used the word, 'Coke,' but 'Volt' was the drink there-- grey sort of a greenish yellow color. It's very similar to Mountain Dew.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, that was the caffeinated drink that you could get?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, Mr. Fitzgibbons told you that none of your conversations with David House or him would ever go into the press.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you knew-- at least at that point, you could tell him something.

Pfc. Manning

Well, I mean we will still under-- I mean we are still being recorded.

Prosecution (Fein)

You are.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And you know its being recorded and kept.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you didn't even take that opportunity to discuss anything about your confinement conditions.

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now, I would like you to-- to think back to 27 February 2011.

Pfc. Manning

Okay.

Prosecution (Fein)

You met with Mr. Fitzgibbons and Mr. House again together?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, they were together.

Prosecution (Fein)

Now this is 27 February. It's right before the March incident and it's right before the New York Times March article?

Pfc. Manning

I don't-- I don't know what those are, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Well the article that I was talking about was used with Col. Oltman that defense counsel was using about the email from Col. Oltman and Col. Choike earlier this week.

Pfc. Manning

Okay.

Prosecution (Fein)

During that meeting actually you had a cold. This is the same time you voluntarily did not do rec call because you were feeling ill.

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, actually David House had the flu, and you laughed about how one had the other, and were afraid you would infect each other. So you wouldn't have to--

Pfc. Manning

We were in a non-contact booth there.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. Then Mr. House asked you, 'How you were doing?'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And the only answer you gave-- the only answer you gave was that you didn't feel well, because you were sick and really wanting antibiotics?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall the antibiotics part, but I needed medication [missed a few words].

Prosecution (Fein)

And then later-- further Mr. House provided you many details of the 'effort to put forward experts and others on your behalf from the public.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, he did. He did. I mostly listened.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then he told you, he was really psyched, because it took a couple weeks to really recruit and find good people.

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, then the very next conversation, rather then again, discussing any of your confinement conditions with him. You discussed your public image being changed from just 'David House making comments to other supporters or others trying to help'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. That was-- that was-- that was my sort of-- last dish attempt at trying to see if Mr. House was actually taking heed of my requests through counsel to stop to the press.

Prosecution (Fein)

Which, he eventually did stop?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall that. We just stopped contact all together.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, once again, you did not discuss your confinement status at all?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, you even have someone in the press with you, and you have Mr. Fitzgibbons there a PR specialist, and you still chose, not to ever discuss your confinement conditions with him?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, despite what was being reported in the press on 3 March, we'll talk about in a moment that you and I just spoke about, you were actually spending a lot of this time talking about many different random topics such like the Sex Pistols Rock band and-- and other-- other unrelated topics?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, then Mr. House explained to you how 'propaganda is really useful, especially in the television [role?]'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. We had a-- we had a intellectual conversation. I think he was quoting some-- some early twentieth century works or something like that.

Prosecution (Fein)

Later in the conversation you coughed, and were asked if it was the food. You were probed to see if it was the food that was making you sick?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you replied the food is 'Good. Not bad.' In fact, you went through it an talked about the Swiss steak and the mashed potatoes you had for dinner--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And stated, 'It's not bad at all. I mean it's not the best I've had in the military, but it's not bad'?

Pfc. Manning

That's correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You were also asked by Mr. House, whether you could get exercise? And you responded, 'Yes,' but you stated, 'Not in the past few days, because you were sick'?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, that was the time you that you voluntarily elected not to do rec call, and still refused to sign that statement.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. It was still uncertainty as to the status of those-- of the documents, whether they were sworn statements or not.

Prosecution (Fein)

Okay. So, we just spoke about that email that was references yesterday. Private First Class Manning, it's a New York Times article. It started with, 'Do you remember this article about your treatment allegedly standing for seven hours naked, and Mr. House commented on your conditions?

Pfc. Manning

I don't-- I never actually me personally read the article. I know of it, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You know it was published on 3 March 2011?

Pfc. Manning

In early March, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

In that article, Mr. House mentions that you were being pressured to cooperate with the Government?

Pfc. Manning

That was-- those were his words, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Correct.And, he also said in his words, that he met with you on the previous weekend, and that is what you told him?

Pfc. Manning

Did I say that to him?

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, that is what I am asking you. Did you have a discussion with Mr. House about being coerced to cooperate with the Government?

Pfc. Manning

I have never-- I've never had-- I have never stated that to him, no.

Prosecution (Fein)

But that was just part of the PR campaign that was that was going on?

Pfc. Manning

I didn't-- I wasn't exactly sure what was going on. I was hearing these-- I was-- that's-- from my understanding [missed word]-- I am mostly trying to avoid talking to Mr. House-- except for talking about, you know, things that had nothing to do either the facility, the case, the, you know, anything surrounding that. I tried-- I tried myself to avoid speaking anything about that, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Which-- which-- which makes sense, but later-- and we'll get to it in a moment-- but, right now, I am just talking about 27 February 2011-- and so up to this point from the very first visitors-- recorded visitors' conversations you had in September 2010 all the way up to 27 February 2011, you never told one person, or discussed with one person your confinement conditions?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

On 13 March 2011, you also Trevor Fitzgibbon and your cousin?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

The conversation started talking about how David, Mr. David House, is in England at that point, or was over in England.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, actually, from what you mentioned before, the conversation then basically went to you were concerned about the message that David House was putting out there?

Pfc. Manning

Definitely, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Because, in your words, 'you were hoping where you mean that what he is actually--' - you're concerned with what 'he was actually thinking or what he just saying'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. That is correct.

Judge Lind

Wait a minute. I didn't [missed word]. Ask that question again.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am. During this conversation that you had with Mr. Fitzgibbon and your cousin, you stated that you had asked them about Mr. House?

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you had asked because you're hearing things and you're seeing things like you were getting worse?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you were concerned that that was what Mr. House actually thought or just what he was saying?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I was concerned about that, yes.

Judge Lind

I thought you asked him an either/or question. Am I confused?

Prosecution (Fein)

I asked a poor question, your Honor. And, That is why I'm re-asking directly. I do not think I was doing an either/or, but I will try one more time.

Judge Lind

Look. I could be completely--

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am.

Judge Lind

--confused.

Prosecution (Fein)

Yes, Ma'am.

[to witness]

You stated that you were concerned of one things-- one or the other thing. That this was your one concern. You concern was that was whether Mr. House actually thought that-- thought you were being treated [missed word], based off what he was saying or that--

Pfc. Manning

--or if he-- or if he was just saying that, and not actually believing it.

Prosecution (Fein)

Correct.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Judge Lind

Alright. And at the same meeting you were very concerned, as you mentioned earlier, that your family was talking to members of the press?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, definitely.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you were very concerned, because your father was talking to the media-- members of the press?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. That is true.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, your cousin's reassuring you that the rest of your family was-- was trying not to-- to keep everyone [missed a few word] from talking to members of the press.

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Apart from my father, yes.

Prosecution (Fein)

Correct. So, you were very concerned at the time and others at the time you removed everyone's names from the list?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You were very concerned about family issues?

Pfc. Manning

Definitely. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, also during this time, you never talked about your actual confinement status.

Pfc. Manning

Correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

You never talked about any type of treatment from the Brig?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You never talked about any-- any-- anyway guards interact with you?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you kept reassuring, everyone, your okay?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

In fact, during this meeting you said that everything was going, 'fine' except you are not getting much sleep.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then you talked really just about 'March Madness'?

Pfc. Manning

Definitely. That is-- that is one of the highlights of my year. I mean, yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

So, based off more than the twenty recordings at Quantico, from 18 September to April--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--you never shared your alleged concerns, you never, to anyone who visited you in person...

Pfc. Manning

That is correct.

Prosecution (Fein)

--despite if you had the opportunity--

Pfc. Manning

[Missed].

Prosecution (Fein)

--and that includes, you didn't-- your company commanders, and, your first company commander and your First Sergeant, except at the times it was documented?

Pfc. Manning

I did talk about my confinement conditions to First Sergeant Williams and Captain Casamatta routinely and repeatedly, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, never to the degree of documenting it?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, never submitting the IG complaint in the box to have a higher level look at what's going on?

Pfc. Manning

I didn't-- again, I didn't-- I wasn't sure how the inspector general portion worked for it, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And, you also chose to not speak to the Brig officials when given the opportunity at the C&A board?

Pfc. Manning

I did go to them. I did-- I did start to go to C&A boards.

Prosecution (Fein)

When, you went, you elected not to talk to them, when they asked you to explain why it was that you are-- that-- why it was you made one statement and then changed the statement.

Pfc. Manning

I did explain. I did attempt it [missed a few words].

Prosecution (Fein)

I guess, just as a final question, Private First Class Manning, yesterday, when Mr. Coombs was asking you about Mr. House and other visitors, you specifically said, you wanted to make sure he didn't stir anything up in the press?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

But, then, why were you having all these people come over, members that were representing you in the press, the entire time at Quantico?

Pfc. Manning

To gauge...to listen in to what they had to say or something, and to give them some reassurance that-- that I am not dying or anything like that--

Prosecution (Fein)

So when that all happened...

Pfc. Manning

--so, to give them a visual reassurance and to keep them close-- keep them close to me, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--but again, every time that happened, you never took the opportunity to talk to them about this?

Pfc. Manning

Definitely not. Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

Thank you. No further questions, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Redirect?

Defense (Coombs)

Yes, your Honor. [to witness] Pfc. Manning, why did you refer to the guards and the facility as, 'very professional'.

Pfc. Manning

They were always very professional, except for-- even there were small occasions where they would leave their role as a sort of-- because, as they are working there, they wear a duty belt and a cover, and that whenever they are in that, they are playing a role as a Marine, and as a Marine correctional specialist, and they never seem to leave that role, when they are wearing that...that cover and that belt, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you believe that the guards and their activity, and how they were treating you, other than on maybe 18 January, was professional?

Pfc. Manning

Absolutely. Definitely, very professional.

Defense (Coombs)

And, can you tell Colonel Lind, why?

Pfc. Manning

Well, they never-- they never spoke degradingly, apart from, you know, in the-- I mean, you know, there was the military bearing-- in particular the Marines Corp style of military bearing, which can be sort of aggressive, but it is still very professional. I mean they never-- they never left that. It was always very-- to be professional. I don't know how else to describe it for you.

Defense (Coombs)

And, with the guards being the people you interact with most--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Why did you then say the facility was professional?

Pfc. Manning

Again, the facility is professional. I mean, it runs, you know. Everything runs on time. Show runs on time. Everything-- everything runs on time. They go by the-- they go by what is written in the books. They go by what is written down. They go by whatever orders are written down. They do exactly what they are told, and they very-- they very infrequently deviated from that from what I saw at the facility, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you ever have any problems with any-- again, setting aside 18 January-- did you ever have any problems with any of the guards as far as how they were treating you?

Pfc. Manning

I mean there were some minor instances here and there of a-- of a uncomfortable moment-- I mean I knew that there was one particular guard that didn't particularly-- I knew I got the vibe from him that he didn't particularly like me or want to be around me, but I-- I didn't-- we just avoided each other essentially, and we didn't talk very much, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Was this any of the guards that were involved in your-- in the 18 January or to your knowledge the 2 March incident?

Pfc. Manning

No, sir. The a-- this guard was Corporal Ratiglio [sp.].

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. So, now let's talk about the voluntary forms. You said you received advice of counsel to not fill those out.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, can you tell Colonel Lind about that?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I started-- I mean the facility started to give me-- I mean, they would give an inmate-- they would give me as an inmate this form, this 'voluntary statement'-- they would give it to me, anytime that I had-- that I wanted to do something that was different from the schedule.

So, if I wasted to change, you know, if I wanted to-- it was more for like refusal of eating or things like that-- which I never-- I never-- I never to my knowledge put that as a sworn statement that I am refusing chow or anything like that, but that's an example of one where it would be use.

Or recreation call was another one, where they-- where if you flat out refuse recreation call, then they would ask you to.-- initially they would ask me to fill it out, and I did.

But, if I was not feeling well or if I just didn't feel like going outside or doing recreation call, then I would fill it out without a problem.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so once you received advice of counsel, not to fill out these forms, when it really wasn't voluntary on your part.

Pfc. Manning

Right.

There was a moment-- I don't recall when, it was probably towards the December timeframe, whenever they started-- they went to these voluntary statements routinely and they-- they kept on putting them in front of me for times, whenever I wasn't getting-- cause there were days in which they-- I would not get rec call, and you know I would just miss it.

And, that happened before, you know in-- I don't recall what day it was, and then, I mean, I would mention it, and then it would be-- I would get comp-- I think I would get comp time-- like if I had a sunshine call one day, then I would-- if I missed a sunshine call one day, then I'd get a recreation or I'd get a sunshine call with thirty or forty minutes the next day-- because it's sort of comp-- cause it's sort of comp time for missing that.

And, that's early on, but there was a certain moment, where they started giving me these sworn-- these voluntary statements, and I don't know.

But, it has a swearing word verbiage at the bottom, that I wasn't sure what the status of this document was. And, I was getting increasingly concerned about having them-- having them presented pretty easily, and what they for.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. So, once I gave you that advice, did you ever have an exchange with Chief Barnes, about whether or not you would be in trouble if you crossed out or refused to fill out these forms?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. There was a-- she's said something that it's against Navy Regulations to cross out and initial portions that removed the voluntary language-- I mean the voluntary language and the-- and, I don't have the verbiage in front of me, but-- I mean to basically cross out and initial on the language that I was uncomfortable with.

And, the fact that I was not allowed to-- she also said that I was not-- that I had to fill these out, that I was not allowed to just flat out refuse to fill them out, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

I am showing you enclosure 26 to the Government's response. I believe it is appellate exhibit 259. Do you see-- if you would-- if you would open up to-- just go to [missed a few words].

In this form, you said that when the First Sergeant commander would ask you questions, and you would kind of go through it with them?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, when you get to-- let's use the 10 September form, which is page seven on that. You see, where you start to talk about prevention of injury and suicide watch?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what do you-- how do you respond to the question, "Do you understand why you are on suicide watch or injury prevention?'

Pfc. Manning

'No.' Well I checked them. That's what I see.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what do they write down there?

Pfc. Manning

'Not aware of why.'

Defense (Coombs)

[to Judge]

So, now I could without going through all this, but I would just ask the Court to take a look at each of these.

On probably two separate occasions, Pfc. Manning states why he not aware of the reasons for why he is on POI.

[to witness]

So, when you were addressing this with the First Sergeant or the Commander, what would their response be?

Pfc. Manning

That-- I mean we would just-- I mean we went over it, because we went over it a lot, and in terms of updates.

If there wasn't an update on anything, we just-- we just. I would say, 'No. I don't understand.'

And, we would move on to the next question. Sometimes-- sometimes. It wasn't always the case, but we would verbally talk about it.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, you also on another occasion. Now this is to fast forward a little bit to 11 February--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

--and that would be page 61 of 87 on the appellate exhibit. Do you see where you respond to, or at least your commander, in this [missed word] case, it's Sergeant First Class Jones wrote down your response on the POI?

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Defense (Coombs)

And, what do you say in response to whether or not you know why you are on SR or POI?

Pfc. Manning

It says, 'Do you understand why you are on suicide watch or injury prevention?' And, I checked in the box, 'No,' or Sergeant First Class Jones does.

Defense (Coombs)

And what else does Sergeant Jones write?

Pfc. Manning

He doesn't write anything in the [missed word] right there. It just says, 'injury prevention six months.'

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. When your commander was coming to talk to you about this, you were at least addressing with them the fact that you didn't know why you were on POI?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

What was from your understanding, if you could tell Colonel Lind, your understand of once you raised the issue with your counsel, how we were going to try to handle the issue of you being on POI and MAX custody?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. We-- I mean we looked at it from the vantage point we wanted-- I mean I wanted to get off of POI, and the best way to accomplish that legally was to exhaust my administrative remedies.

And that was to go through each different step in the process, and you know, reach that conclusion.

We figured we would get there, you know, about a few-- we would check on-- we would check on a couple of these boxes in terms of exhausting administrative remedies, eventually the POI restriction would be lifted.

Defense (Coombs)

Alright, so before I advised you on filing a complaint or doing anything.

What was the first thing informally that we talked about possibly a way to get you of the MAX and POI?

Pfc. Manning

Just talking to the staff. And, talking to-- in particular, I mean it was the health care provider in particular that I was talking to.

Defense (Coombs)

Did I inform you at that point, what I would be doing to try to get you off of MAX and POI?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you recall me ever saying that I was going to talk to the trial counsel about this?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. We discussed this over the phone, and you-- I mean you said that you would-- I mean because I brought it up through my counsel, through you, sir.

As soon as I brought it up to you, you said, 'Hey,' you know, 'this is something I need to bring up with trial counsel and see-- and see what they are doing in their mind,' or, 'what they can do about this on their end.'

Defense (Coombs)

And, I know it's been a while, but do you recall kind of what I was telling you was happening from, you know, I was able to do for you?

Pfc. Manning

You emailed them. You emailed, I remember then Captain Fein, now Major. Fein responded back and said that he was going to look into it.

Defense (Coombs)

And, with regards to, I guess, the actions that were being taken informally. When did that come to a head, in your mind, where those steps were failing, and you'd be more formal?

Pfc. Manning

I put in a 5-10 in December, and I have always vocally said to the staff.

You know, I started asking questions. I got this discrepancy between-- I remember I got this discrepancy between what now Master Sergeant was saying and what Captain Hocter was saying about why I was on POI status.

So now I know, [missed word] had no idea what the justification was because medical health provider is saying one thing.

The counselor is saying another thing. And, I remember I put in a 5-10 regarding that to, I believe I directed it to Gunnery Sergeant Blenis-- then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis.

And, I never heard back on it. I never-- I don't know what happened to that form in mid-December.

And, because we-- nothing ever came up with them, and I talked to you about the fact of [missed a word], and we decided to go forward or I thought you meant, because I misunderstood, because I put in another 5-10 to the commander.

I think you, as I found out earlier, that you sent a memorandum detailing the exact same thing, but through the [missed word] counsel.

So, it's still me requesting from the commander to review it, but--

Defense (Coombs)

Do you know if we received any sort of response from my memorandum directly to Chief Averhart?

Pfc. Manning

I don't recall. I don't recall what that was, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, after a period of time--

Pfc. Manning

--I mean obviously nothing happened.

Defense (Coombs)

And, after a period of time we filed a 138 complaint, what did I tell you about that process?

Pfc. Manning

From what you-- from what you said, and what from doing, you know, I think you had to do some paperwork on the 138-- the Article 138 process, and so I had that, but it was just-- it was just for general-- it was that, we take a commander-- it has to be a commander that makes a decision and whether or not-- and, I-- and we have to believe that I was wronged in them making that decision, but in some way, according to the statute.

And then-- and then we would bring that up to the next highest-- the next high level to the General, all the way up to General Court Martial Convening Authority, and to the Service Secretary eventually.

Defense (Coombs)

And, when I was explaining the process to you, you got denied at every step of the way, all the way up to the Secretary of the Navy in this instance.

What did I tell you what I would do next?

Pfc. Manning

We would file a writ of extraordinary relief to the Army Court of Criminal Appeals.

Defense (Coombs)

What was out goal there?

Pfc. Manning

It was to get off of POI status, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Now, obviously we didn't have to do that, because you got moved, right?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir. We accomplished out goal.

Defense (Coombs)

Trial counsel asked you a lot of questions about the family visits that you got, and the conversations that you had.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Do you want to tell me why, you didn't want to talk about your confinement conditions when you family and friends visited you?

Pfc. Manning

Two reasons. One, I didn't want to my family-- I didn't want my family to be worried or concerned about me.

I mean I am sitting in front of them. They can see-- they clearly see that I'm in, you know, restraints and everything else.

And, I can see that they are uncomfortable with what they see. And, I didn't want to bring that up.

They see that I have two Marines behind me, and I didn't want them to-- I didn't want them to have to experience-- experience much more of that. I didn't want to bring it up. It's like the elephant in the room, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

What were you concerned about from that?

Pfc. Manning

I was also concerned that-- that they might end my-- they might secure my visits, and say that I did something wrong, because-- it was understood that you weren't really suppose to talk about what's going in the facility.

I mean I don't know if that's the rule or anything, but it was generally understood that it was probably not a good idea to talk about the facility like, you know, like any specific details about it to visitors first, for both security reasons, you know, and that the whole process of everything, dates and times, and transport issues and things like that.

I didn't want to get into the-- into the details of, you know, because I figured that would be a very quick reason to end those visitations for security reasons, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Now, why did you chose not to write a lot as far as sending out letters?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I didn't have-- I mean I was able to visit family or I was able to have family visit. I got that backwards. I couldn't leave, so I couldn't visit them, but.

So, because I was in that area, and most of my-- most of my family are in or were available to visit, I didn't see as necessary-- I didn't see it as being necessary to have to write a lot.

And then, I didn't want to facility to-- because I-- in the few time that I did write something, they would scrutinize every single word, and ask me what I meant, and if I was trying to use code words or something like that.

So, I was really-- I was really uncomfortable writing anything, because I knew the guards would go through it.

Defense (Coombs)

Another question caused me a little bit of confusion, because Major Fein asked you about you saying, 'How do I look? I am wearing glasses again.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

My understanding is you need glasses. Do you need glasses?

Pfc. Manning

I do. I wear-- I'm near sighted. I would wear contact lenses, but, you know, correctional facilities don't typically allow you to keep those, unless you don't have any other means until you can get glasses.

Defense (Coombs)

So, what he meant was, you normally wear contacts, and now you wear glasses?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. That makes sense.

Pfc. Manning

So, I asked him how I was looking, cause I just tried to avoid-- I just tried to avoid the big issues.

Defense (Coombs)

The Facebook photos. You wanted certain Facebook photos taken down or what not, what was the concern there?

Pfc. Manning

Just family and I didn't want-- I didn't want, you know, a lot of people to go through my personal photos and stuff.

I mean I didn't have a-- I didn't have a public-- I mean if you have access-- only friends or friends of friends have access to my Facebook account and I kept that-- you know-- so if you searched my name in 2009, you wouldn't be able to find my Facebook or anything like that.

Because I didn't want people to-- I didn't want to spread to much of my pictures and things of what I was doing. And, I wanted to-- more people were having access to it, since some people that were friends, and I didn't have access to my Facebook account at this time, and I still don't.

But, I would have the person who was a friend start to copy pictures from my account-- to copy messages that were posted in 2009 or 2008 that were up there.

And, I was uncomfortable with that, but I didn't-- I didn't, because people already had exact verbatim copies of everything after that point.

Defense (Coombs)

So, when you mean you were uncomfortable with your--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, because--

Defense (Coombs)

--Facebook being out in the public?

Pfc. Manning

The public, public. Because, I mean I had-- I know-- I know that Facebook is public but, I mean, I had restrictions on my account circa 2009, and early 2010 that, you know, I even considered having somebody just delete the account.

But, it became no longer a priority, after-- after somebody had already verbatim copied everything and copied all the images and everything else. Then, I didn't see the point.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay, so when somebody copied everything--

Pfc. Manning

It was too-- too late at that point.

Defense (Coombs)

--that became public then?

Pfc. Manning

Somebody was going to make-- somebody was going to make it public. And, it eventually did.

I think there is a verbatim of everything, including an entire copy of my friends list out there.

And, that was another thing. I didn't want people that-- to get targeted for being associated with me in any way, shape, or form with me.

Defense (Coombs)

Okay. Now trial counsel also asked you some questions about fundraising. What was your concerns about fundraising?

Pfc. Manning

I don't know. I don't recall exactly what I was saying, but they're doing most of the-- I'm trying to keep it so they're doing most of the talking.

I don't want-- I'm not really involved in fundraising or anything like that, sir.

I mean I know that-- I know that you are getting paid, that-- that is an agreement that we have that you are getting paid, sir, so.

I don't know how exactly how that process works or whatnot, but it's working.

Defense (Coombs)

It is.

Pfc. Manning

That's what I understand.

Defense (Coombs)

That's what I understand too.

Pfc. Manning

I wasn't going flat broke was my main concern.

Defense (Coombs)

I understand.

Pfc. Manning

[Missed].

Defense (Coombs)

So, in statement's not going to the press. Trial counsel asked you questions about the fact that you told Mr. House and Mr. Fitzgibbons that you didn't want what you said to them to go to the press. Why was that?

Pfc. Manning

I didn't want, you know, I didn't want any [missed word] to really-- I mean I saw this as being a, you know, a case-- from a case standpoint, I wanted this-- I wanted a proper court-martial.

I didn't want-- the court of public opinion was not where I wanted this, you know, to all take place.

Defense (Coombs)

Did you ever give me, as your counsel, any guidance on going to the press?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Limited. I gave you a lot actually. [laughs] I remember that I didn't want you to do much. If you-- I remember you-- you had Mr. Fitzgibbon contact you or he contacted-- I don't know how that went.

I don't recall, but just as a consulting role from what you understood, and the way I understood it was just to advise us on that. And, how certain things might look or what not.

Defense (Coombs)

Generally, what was your guidance to me about speaking to the press?

Pfc. Manning

My guidance to you. Limited and text. If it was going to be-- if it was going to be something that, you know, if [people?] read your blog, I think is-- obviously, I don't have access to a computer or the Internet, so I haven't seen it myself, but I have seen print offs and things-- was that you-- that you just post things up, and try to get as accurate as possible, and try to get to the actual topic and try to be as factual as possible, and try to be as neutral as possible, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

So, you didn't want me running to the press and making grand comments about it?

Pfc. Manning

And, making interviews and basically grandstanding is the way I would term it-- termed it to you, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

Now there was some confusion over a kind of a compound question of trial counsel where mixing a couple things regarding Mr. House.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

And, there were apparently some statements about your overall health? For the Judge's edification, what were you concerned about regarding Mr. House's statements about how you looked and what was going on with you in the confinement facility?

Pfc. Manning

Well the-- I was-- I was worried that the facility in particular was going to use those to justify continuing the status, sir.

Defense (Coombs)

What about factually the statements that you were looking worse and worse. You were not responsive, and all that stuff?

Pfc. Manning

I tried-- I tried to convey the fact that I was stable, and that I was improving, you know, whenever I got there.

I mean in terms of being-- I mean I don't know-- I don't know how objective they were-- I mean I was-- and that was why that particular question came up because I wasn't sure if that was what he actually believed or if that he was just saying that to get press attention. [missed a few words].

Defense (Coombs)

And, obviously, you would agree that Mr. House and the other where just there trying to help you really?

Pfc. Manning

They-- maybe-- I didn't know. I didn't know for sure. I didn't-- that is why I limited my association.

I was trying to just be very careful in what I said, and how I interacted.

I mostly-- like the substantial like the conversations occurred through you.

So, my concerns and my criticism came from you in particular to them in regards to the confinement conditions and et cetera from my vantage point. I don't know if that was a confusing answer.

Defense (Coombs)

No. It made perfect sense. Thank you.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Judge Lind

Now, Pfc. Manning, I have a few questions for you.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, your Honor.

Judge Lind

In the command visit notes that the trial counsel went through with you?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, your Honor.

Judge Lind

As I went through them I looked at the 10th, the 19th, and the 23rd, and the 30th of September; the 27th of October; the 10th, 14th, 23rd, and 30th of December; and the 10th, 5th, 14th, and 20th of January; the 12th, the 11th...I'm sorry...the 4th, the 11th, the 12th, and the 23th of February; and then 2, 11, 18, and 23, and 31 March of [20]11. You check a lot of the boxes or the box is checked that you don't understand why you are on POI?

Pfc. Manning

That is correct, your Honor.

Judge Lind

But, the 7th, 15th, the 21st of October and the 12th and the 26th of November, say you do.

Pfc. Manning

I'm not sure where that discrepancy comes from, but I did-- I did say that I did not understand. Most of them--

Judge Lind

Well, there's like a six week chunk were you say you do. That's what's confusing.

Pfc. Manning

Can you-- can you-- I mean what are those dates, [Ma'am?]?

Judge Lind

The chunk-- the chunk were you say you do is-- begins on the 7th of October and goes to the 26th of November--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Ma'am.

Judge Lind

--absent the 7th [missed word?] of October were you say you don't understand. I think that I am a little confused as to why there is that difference?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I started to understand-- from my vantage point I understood that it was Captain Hocter's recommendation that I remain on POI.

So, I understood why that-- why I was placed on POI, and that was because Captain Hocter was making the recommendation, even though he was not making that recommendation.

That was what I understood. I did not know what the recommendations were at that time.

Judge Lind

And, what changed to make you not understand on the 10th of December?

Pfc. Manning

Through discussions with then Gunnery Sergeant Blenis and through Captain Hocter, I started to get discrepancies and I was very concerned at that point, because--

And, I started-- I mean I wasn't sure who to believe in terms of whether it was Captain Hocter that was keeping me on prevention of injury status or making recommendations to the commander to keep me on prevention of injury status or whether it was the C&A board; or whether or not it was the-- just the commander making the decision, other than that.

I did not understand.

Judge Lind

When you talked to your chain of command during these visit, I mean was it just a check the box thing or did you say, 'Hey, I don't understand why I've been here four month, six month--'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. It wasn't just a check the box.

Sometimes it was, just because-- I mean I am not going to say it wasn't a serious thing-- because, nothing would have changed between the different command visits.

So, since I had an understanding with Captain Casamatta that, you know, 'Hey, I'm on-- I'm on prevention of injury status and I would like to get off,' but--

Judge Lind

Did you ever ask him to help you?

Pfc. Manning

I did, Ma'am.

Judge Lind

Did he?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I wasn't sure what he could do.

I mean, he's-- he's in the Army-- on the Army side of the chain of command and he was my company commander.

I didn't get the impression that it was-- I mean I always thought that he was looking out for my best interests and-- and following up on whenever I had concerns or something, he would follow up on it.

And, I would get-- I would get these communications-- I think I was getting his communications with Mr. Coombs about that as well that the command was, you know, still raising the concern through their chain of command.

I don't-- I think there was a particular incident where-- and I don't-- I don't have personal knowledge of it, but where Captain Casamatta was talking to the Battalion commander and to the-- I think he went directly to Colonel Coffman about the status [missed word], you Honor.

Judge Lind

Did he ever say anything to members of the Brig personnel and ask them to [missed a few words]--

Pfc. Manning

They always-- they were always at the physical Brig itself, and they would talk to the guards behind me, and they would sometimes talk to-- to the DBS or the Quantico Brig commander, whoever that was at the time, whether it was Chief Warrant Officer Two Barnes or Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart.

But, I mean I don't know what was in these conversations.

Judge Lind

So, at any time did Captain Casamatta or anybody in your chain of command come back to you and say, 'I talked to Chief Averhart, and he told me that based on these following considerations that this is the reason that you're still on POI'?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. I had talked to him, and he had said that he had was-- he was speaking to the Brig staff about these issues every time, and he was looking into them.

And, he kept on looking. And, he kept on looking into it, and he was being cognizant of what was going on.

I listened. That was the understanding that I had. In particular with-- with Captain Casamatta and First Sergeant Williams. I mean they were quote 'tracking the issue' unquote.

Judge Lind

You arrived at Quantico at the end of July--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, you Honor.

Judge Lind

--you are on 'suicide risk' at that point...

Pfc. Manning

Yes, you Honor.

Judge Lind

--what kind of clothing do you have at that point, at night?

Pfc. Manning

At night I have underwear, T Shirt, and I don't recall if I had socks or not. I think I did have socks.

Judge Lind

What happens at reveille?

Pfc. Manning

I would have-- I would be given-- after reveille would be announced-- some period after that, whether it was during five of twenty minutes-- I don't recall the exact number, because there was a hygiene call with that-- then I would have-- I would be given either a duty uniform-- I would be given their duty uniform, because I didn't have sweats or anything at that time.

Judge Lind

When they come-- where I am going with this is-- when they come to the count what are you doing and what are you wearing?

Pfc. Manning

I was wearing underwear, socks, flip flops-- and I'm recalling this a lot easier now.

It's a better question I think-- and I had a POI-- and I was authorized to wear and expected to wear a POI blanket over-- because I was just wearing underwear or just underwear and a shirt, your Honor.

Judge Lind

So, you're wearing underwear and a shirt, and you are authorized to put the POI blanket over you?

Pfc. Manning

During count. Yes, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Whom-- how do you know you were authorized to do that?

Pfc. Manning

They instructed me that it was-- that it was okay, because I was on suicide risk in that for a particular time, and that they were aware of that, and that I should-- that I should cover up, and that, you know, they didn't want to be demeaning or anything like.

Judge Lind

You testified earlier that during reveille everyone had to stand first at parade rest, then at attention, then at parade rest--

Pfc. Manning

Right.

Judge Lind

--are you suppose to-- how do you do that with a blanket? Or did they allow you to put the blanket...

Pfc. Manning

It was--

Judge Lind

--or they did allow you to put the blanket and whatever and hold it over your front?

Pfc. Manning

That-- that is the position, so. You were-- I would usually-- I would typically have it covered and holding it, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Let the record reflect that the witness has his arms over his chest.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, so it would be covered and then my legs would be spread during parade rest-- parade rest and that. And, then I would bring them together for attention, but still with the arms over the chest, your Honor.

Judge Lind

When you go to POI what do you got at night?

Pfc. Manning

I think I was given a-- I don't exactly recall but I think I had-- there were handling instructions, but I think I was authorized a part of shorts.

So, I didn't-- that mooted the issue of having to have a blanket for-- for standing by for count and count, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Alright. 3 March the morning of-- walk me through from the beginning.

Pfc. Manning

On 3 March they announced count or they announced--

Judge Lind

Before we get there let me just ask a couple of questions. How many guards are in the Brig right around before reveille?

Pfc. Manning

I have no idea your Honor.

Judge Lind

Or in the observation room?

Pfc. Manning

In the observation room, there was usually between two and four Marines Corps personnel.

Judge Lind

At night?

Pfc. Manning

At night. At day. Usually, it was staff [missed a few words].

Judge Lind

I'm sorry. Let me direct you back to the 3 March.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, your Honor. So, they announced, 'Reveille Reveille Reveille' in the housing unit, then 'Stand by for count.'

I was not given hygiene-- We did not do a hygiene call. So, it was not a 'shaving before count.' So, then I-- I stand up, and I don't have any clothes. I just have the POI blanket, but, I don't have flip flops. So, it's just stand at the front of my cell as normal, but with-- at a modified position at parade rest.

Defense (Coombs)

Wait a minute. You don't have a POI blanket? Am, I confused?

Pfc. Manning

I have two POI blankets. So I have-- I don't have clothes.

Judge Lind

Okay. Would you be standing the same way that you would be standing as you described earlier when you had your underwear?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. Yes, Ma'am.

Judge Lind

With the blanket wrapped?

Pfc. Manning

Wrapped around, yes.

Judge Lind

Around you, okay. Go on.

Pfc. Manning

So, then I would have the blanket wrapped around me, and then I was instructed-- And, then-- I mean I don't exactly know how-- how it was worded, but-- but the door was cracked-- and the door cracked open and-- and--

Judge Lind

What door?

Pfc. Manning

The door to the observation booth opened.

The guard inside then asked something to the effect of like, 'Detainee Manning, is that how you stand at parade rest?'

I wasn't sure how to answer that question in terms of both: I couldn't see really-- I mean I didn't have my glasses and I couldn't see rank or if that person standing at the door. I believe-- I believe that the person was sitting down.

Judge Lind

Did you recognize the voice?

Pfc. Manning

I did not, your Honor. They-- from the observation booth they sound mostly the same, unless it's something over the intercom. They-- the male voices sound pretty- It echoes. They sound really similar.

Judge Lind

Okay.

Pfc. Manning

And, I don't recall-- I recall being confused about that-- about the rank in particular.

And, then I said-- I tried to word the question something to the effect of, 'Excuse me, Lance Corporal,' or 'I'm not sure what you are trying to ask.'

That was the gist of what I was trying to ask. I don't recall the exact phrasing.

And, then the phrase-- the statement was said again. And, then I-- I think I asked. I recall asking, 'Should I put the blanket-- Do you want me to put the blanket down?' And then there being a, 'Yes,' or something like that. So, I set the blanket down and went to parade rest, your Honor.

Judge Lind

What happened after that?

Pfc. Manning

Then they went through count. Or they announce-- they announced--

Judge Lind

Oh, I'm sorry. Was there a response to that?

Pfc. Manning

No. I just-- Well, the door closed. So, the-- the door was [missed word] only cracked open.

Judge Lind

When did the door closed?

Pfc. Manning

When did the door close? After I set the blanket down, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Was there a response? You asked, 'Do you want me to put the blanket down?' and [missed a few words] respond?

Pfc. Manning

I set the blanket down. Before, I set the blanket down, I think-- I think, yeah-- I think there was a, 'Yes. Detainee Manning--,' or something to-- I don't recall if it was just a, "Yes,' or if it was a-- or if it was a verbatim instruction [missed a few words].

Judge Lind

Okay. So, what happens next?

Pfc. Manning

Then-- because-- I mean we're standing-- we're standing by for count-- That was the status that we were in at that time. And, then as the Duty Brig Supervisor comes near special quarters, from the view point of the guards--

And, I am inferring this from just experience of being there--

Then, they unlock the door and then one of the Marines comes out on the opposite side of the observation booth of the other side--

So the door opens on the opposite side where the other two cells are-- are at, and then announces to the entire housing unit, 'Special Quarters Atten-hun' or 'Attention.'

And then the Duty Brig Supervisor comes in and goes to-- goes to my cell and then does the knife hand move and then walks on.

Judge Lind

Okay. You say the Duty Brig Supervisor comes in. What do they do for count when they go by your cell? Do they-- Do they face your cell? Do they walk in a straight line past your cell?

Pfc. Manning

They-- They walk with a sense of urgency past the cell, but they stop, they slow down for each cell and then they do sort of--

Depending on who it was-- I remember this particular-- this particular morning that it was-- I couldn't see who was it was.

I didn't have my glasses on, but there was a knife hand movement, and then moved-- and then continued on down--

Judge Lind

Let me see what a knife hand movement is [missed a few words].

Pfc. Manning

Like that. [demonstrated with his hand]

Judge Lind

Like you are cutting a cake?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, your Honor. So-- [demonstrates with his hand] Towards-- Towards-- this end.

Judge Lind

And, are the lights on?

Pfc. Manning

The lights are on, yes. Both in-- outside the cell, throughout special quarters, and inside my cell, yes.

Judge Lind

And, what happens after the knife movement?

Pfc. Manning

Then-- I mean-- He is still walking but slows down for that movement, and then continues walking very quickly-- Increases the speed back to the--

Judge Lind

And, what happens next, what do you do?

Pfc. Manning

Well, I wait for the command. As he goes to the other side of this horseshoe arrangement, and exists in what they call bravo row door--

Which was the alternate side on the opposite side of the observation booth, and then the guard announces, 'Parade rest,' again, and then you stand, and then I stood back at parade rest until-- until I guess they announce, 'All clear,' over the radio, and then we fall out.

And, then we walk back to [missed a few words], and then we fall out, Ma'am.

Judge Lind

Okay. And then moving on then to the morning of 4 March, what happened?

Pfc. Manning

4 March. That's the morning after this. You know, what I recall at least-- I mean I don't know-- I don't recall how many days this occurred, but I--

Whenever I was getting out, 'Reveille Reveille Reveille,' at this-- at this point in time.

They had my clothing all ready set up on the feed tray of the cell. So, as soon as they announced-- as soon as they announce, 'Reveille Reveille Reveille,' I am able to grab my clothing.

Put it on. Put my glasses on. Then, whenever-- Then, I'm-- I'm semi dressed by the time--

Or I might be completely dressed by the time they announce, 'Stand by for count,' your Honor.

Judge Lind

Okay. 5th of March?

Pfc. Manning

5th of March. I don't recall if-- I don't recall if it was two days or one day between whenever I had this, but on either the 5th or the 6th of March, I did not receive my clothing on the feed tray at reveille.

So, I sat sort of Indian style with the POI blanket until they announced, 'Stand by for count.'

And, then given the guidance that I had, that I understood from that, I stood by at the front of the cell back at parade rest without the POI blanket, just like the other day-- Just like the 3rd of March.

But, before count was announced, one of the-- I mean the guard had quickly placed and handed me clothing.

So, that I was able to dress and I was dresses just in time for whenever they announced for-- Just in time for them to announce, 'Attention.'-- 'Special Quarter's Attention.'

Judge Lind

So, if I understand your testimony then there is one morning that you're standing naked at 'Attention.'

Pfc. Manning

Yes, Ma'am. Completely, for that entire 'count'. Yes, your Honor.

Judge Lind

Okay. So, you testified earlier that during hygiene call your given a razor to shave?

Pfc. Manning

Yes.

Judge Lind

Is that true on suicide risk?

Pfc. Manning

Yes. It's true for all status.

Judge Lind

Do they watch you while you are doing that? Or did they--

Pfc. Manning

Sometimes. Sometimes.

Judge Lind

--just leave it with you in the cell?

Pfc. Manning

Sometimes they would-- Yeah, they would most of the time-- They would just hand-- They would just leave it in my feed tray, and then, you know, I would go, and they would leave.

They would get the razor and the shave cream out of the cell adjacent to me, where I have my hygiene items, and they would place it on the feed tray or hand it to me, if I was standing-- If I was standing there, they would just hand it to me.

And, then I would put the shaving cream on my face, shave, and then return, and place the razor and the shaving cream back into-- Back onto the feed tray, you Honor.

Judge Lind

What kind of razor was it?

Pfc. Manning

It was a-- I remember-- I remember I had a MACH3-- So a two blazed razor at one point, and then I had a Gillette Fusion at one point. So, five bladed razor.

Judge Lind

Where you told at any time that Gunnery Sergeant Blenis didn't think that you were-- felt that you were being pretty quiet during-- in arrival September, October-- that you weren't being very proactive?

Pfc. Manning

I mean, I didn't know-- I didn't know how much interaction-- I don't know what he means by that?

Judge Lind

Did he tell you at any time during September or October that, you know, 'You're not really talking very much. I'm concerned?'

Pfc. Manning

Not that he was concerned. He certainly-- He certainly like, 'You're pretty quiet.'

And, I think I might have-- I think I might have explained to him that, you know, 'I don't have a lot to say.'

I mean, 'I'm not really doing a whole lot. There is not a lot going on,' you know.

We talked. Then, we had some small talk on occasions. We used to talk about current events, sports, [missed word] theory, but--

Judge Lind

Cause that is what is confusing me slightly too is you testified yesterday that you were very extroverted person who wants to be around people--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, I do.

Judge Lind

--then why didn't you talk when you had the opportunity to talk to him?

Pfc. Manning

Well, it's a different-- I mean, and I did talk to him.

I felt that I was talking to him. You know, I like to talk. I mean, I like to talk [missed a few words] everything.

I get energy from-- from being around people or group of people, but it was just this sort of one on one conversation, and I felt that we were-- I felt that we were having kind of a decent conversation.

Sometimes-- Sometimes I just didn't have a whole lot to talk about or I was just out-- out of energy from being bored all day, and not really having a lot to do.

And, you know, we would talk about things that were not necessarily that interesting to me. We didn't have a lot of similar interests, me and now Master Sergeant Blenis.

We didn't have a-- we had some-- we had some overlaps, in terms of college basketball, and things like that.

But, we didn't have a lot of similar interests on certain things, at things on what I could gather.

Judge Lind

When was the first time that you remember-- You testified earlier that you tried to handle this informally in the beginning.

Did you ever talk to Gunnery Sergeant Blenis or anybody else at the Brig about, 'What can I do to make you all think that I am stable and I'm not--?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, yes. Correct. Correct. I don't know when I started.

I mean in the very beginning I wanted to convey the fact that whenever I arrived at Quantico Base Brig in July 2010-- I wanted the staff to know that, you know, that I was fine.

I wanted to get off of the status, and I wanted to find out how I could do that to [missed a few words].

You know, enjoy an increased quality of life form my vantage point, your Honor.

Judge Lind

The first time that you opted to appear in front of the C&A board in January--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, your Honor.

Judge Lind

--why didn't you go earlier and try to make your case then?

Pfc. Manning

It was a lot of-- I mean-- There was a lot of different-- There's a lot of different factors involved with that.

I mean one, I thought it was-- For the longest period of time I thought it was-- I thought Captain Hocter was the person that was making-- that was keeping me on.

And, that was my understanding at least for the summer and autumn of 2010 that Captain Hocter was the-- was the person who really made that call as to my status, your Honor.

Judge Lind

And that was your understanding for the Fall of 2010?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, your Honor.

Judge Lind

When did that become not your understanding?

Pfc. Manning

When I started to ask-- ask question to Captain Hocter along the lines of, 'Why?'

I remember I asked him specifically what- what he was recommending. I had not asked what he was recommending to him. So, at a certain point I did, and it was at that point, that he told me that he was recommending that I be taken off.

Then, I started talking to Gunnery Sergeant Blenis about the fact that Captain Hocter told me that-- because Gunnery Sergeant Blenis was telling- was telling me that it was the quote 'docs' that were keeping me on 'prevention of injury status-- that were making that recommendation after all.

Judge Lind

Okay. So, Gunnery-- Let me make sure I understand. So, Gunnery Sergeant Blenis was telling you that it was the doctors that were keeping you on POI status?

Pfc. Manning

He would call them the quote 'docs'. I mean, I don't know if he's referring to just Captain Hocter or other medical personnel.

But, he would call them the 'docs' or the 'psychs'.

Judge Lind

Did he or anyone else explain to you how the C&A process worked?

Pfc. Manning

I didn't not really get into the details of the C&A board process. I just assumed that everything was working in order and that I didn't need to be involved.

I-- I didn't feel like-- I thought that-- that improvement overtime would be enough for them to make a recommendation or not-- or for somebody to make a decision that eventually I learned it was the Brig commander that made that decision but--

Judge Lind

And, my last question to you will be, when in the process did you- did you-- or did you ever come to believe that improvement over time wouldn't change it?

Pfc. Manning

Well, there was a-- there were two times that I had come to that realization separately-- because of the change of command at the facility or at the Brig.

So, after the January 18th incident which I was placed on suicide risk status after I had talked to Captain Hocter and Captain-- Captain Moore on that day.

I felt the sense that I was not going to get off of this status ever, as long as-- or off of POI status in particular, even though I was on SR status that at some point would come off of that, and just go back onto POI status.

I was convinced that as long as-- as Chief Warrant Officer Four Averhart is the commander of the facility that-- and I knew that he was- he was going to have a change over soon, so I was-- I was convinced that at that point nothing until the change in command-- or whatever the Marines Corps calls it-- took place that I would continue to be on the POI or SR status, a precaution status.

Judge Lind

Any follow up questions based on that?

Pfc. Manning

--Oh. I-- there was the second.

Judge Lind

Oh, I'm sorry. Go ahead.

Pfc. Manning

So, the second portion was after the March 3rd incident I was-- after the underwear comment that I made and the flip flops that I made to Master Sergeant Papakie and to-- to Chief Warrant Officer Two Barnes-- or that I made to Master Sergeant Papakie and then it was relayed to Chief Warrant Officer Two Barnes.

After that-- a few days after that I did not think that-- that I would-- I pretty much lost hope in the fact that the new-- this new commander was going to change [missed a few words].

Judge Lind

Thank you. Any follow up based on that?

Defense (Coombs)

No, your Honor.

Prosecution (Fein)

No, your Honor, but the Government does request a quick follow up to issue that defense had elicited on direct.

Judge Lind

Okay.

Prosecution (Fein)

Private First Class Manning just in reference to a question that Mr. Coombs had asked you about when you met with your family member in visitors booths, why you withheld certain information from them

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

This is in reference to that. That question. You testified...

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

You testified that you were concerned with your family members worrying about you?

Pfc. Manning

Definitely, sir

Prosecution (Fein)

Were you concerned about your friends worrying about you too?

Pfc. Manning

Of course, but I mean, I didn't really have-- I think friend wise I would call Mr. Clark a friend, so yes, in that sense, Mr. Clark in particular.

For many of my-- for many-- for many of the people that I considered friends did not come with-- to visit me, while I was at Quantico Base Brig, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And so what about-- and then, were you also then worried about what the media consultants or the PR experts would think when they came and visited you and you didn't talk to them about it?

Pfc. Manning

I don't really-- I mean they-- they were-- they were there.

I was more-- I was more concerned about having-- having sort of-- because I knew that they-- no matter what they were going to talk to whoever about whatever.

I mean they have-- they have First Amendment rights to do that.

So, they can speak to whoever and whatever, and-- but, I wanted them to-- I wanted them to-- I wanted to hear from them, and see them personally.

So, that's why I sort of had them on the visitor list, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And then, as far as what you talked about specifically about Mr. House, for instance--

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

--you were concerned about what he would- was saying in the media?

Pfc. Manning

Yes, sir. And, about how that would be perceived specifically by Quantico Base Brig personnel, sir.

Prosecution (Fein)

And-- and, you would agree that at some point, you realized that what was being put out in the media wasn't necessarily accurate?

Pfc. Manning

I would say so, yes, from their standpoint-- I mean that's why I had-- that's why we arranged-- why me and Mr. Coombs arranged for these blog postings is because I wanted-- that was the-- we were really trying [to?] hold, you know, the middle ground, and try to get just the facts--

As many facts as possible, and not, you know, [missed a few words].

Prosecution (Fein)

So there was information from people who did visit you being put out to the media that was false about your conditions?

Pfc. Manning

That I believe could be-- that was not necessarily accurate or that was portrayed in a slanted light. I'm a fact-- I am more of a scientific person. I like things to be more factual, and as objective-- I mean as-- There's gonna be some subjectivity in this. That's inevitable in the world, you know.

In this [missed word] especially, you know. To try to put as many objective facts on the table as possible, and to counter a lot of the wildness, is what I was particularly concerned about.

Prosecution (Fein)

Well, thank you. No further questions your Honor.

Judge Lind

Okay.

Defense (Coombs)

[Missed but in the negative], your Honor.

Judge Lind

Pfc. Manning please return to your chair.

Pfc. Manning

Yes, your Honor.

Alexa O'Brien Alexa O'Brien is a investigative journalist. Her work has been published in The Cairo Review of Global Affairs, Guardian UK, Salon, The Daily Beast, and featured on the BBC, PBS Frontline, On The Media, Democracy Now!, and Public Radio International. In 2013, she was shortlisted for the Martha Gellhorn Prize for Journalism in the UK and listed in The Verge 50.